Fuel pump issue?

Hi, I think I have a fuel pump issue. Or, 'tilt sensor'?

When hot, and low on fuel, the bike will not accellerate and will stumble under load.

I read about a tilt sensor (had one on a ST1100 and had to remove it as it caused the same problem).

Does the Deauville 700 have a tilt sensor? If so, can you remove it to elimate it as a potential problem-causer?

Thanks.

The fuel pump is cooled by the fuel in the tank so it may be possible that the pump is operating above its normal operating temperature.

I have not heard of a tilt sensor causing your symptoms on an NT700

Seagrass

Yes, the NT has what Honda calls the Bank Angle Sensor. I always called it the tipover switch.

Know if you can remove it or bypass the 'tilt/tip over' sensor?

Or, has anyone used the fuel pump 'rebuild' kits off eBay eg http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/KRAFTSTOFFPUMPE-BENZINPUMPE-Fuel-Pump-Honda-NT-700-NT700-Deauville-2007-2012-/122708752952?hash=item1c9202fa38:g:ZpUAAOSw1~JZRRYw ?

Thanks. Got caught on the highway yesterday with no power and it wasn't fun!

The bank angle sensor is there to kill the fuel pump when the bike is down, like in an accident. It appears that you could jumper the white/black stripe wire to the red/white stripe wire to bypass it, if that's something you're willing to chance. Otherwise, SENSOR, BANK ANGLE, 35161-MEE-641, List $85.16, Online $60.89. You can dismount it and roll it 60 degrees to test it.

If you think the bank angle sensor may be an issue I would test it's contacts several times to rule it out.
I don't see that it fits your symptoms. The low on fuel symptom shouldn't affect the bank angle sensor. When you say hot, how hot are you talking? I know it can get pretty hot in OZ but isn't it the start of spring there?


Brad

If you want to rule the bank angle sensor out as the problem (or confirm that it is the problem)....the bypass jumper could just be used temporarily.

If the symptoms continue....then it is not the sensor.

I was thinking it was the bank angle sensor as it's a well-known issue with ST1100s, and it felt similar (surges at high throttle inputs). I had an ST1100 last year which suffered from the same thing.

I'm going to buy the fuel pump kit on eBay, and keep it on hand. I have a 12 day trip in a few weeks and won't get a chance to fit it prior.

When I say hot, I mean the bike has been running for at least an hour straight. Seemingly (despite what the temp gauge says), after that time the fuel tank is warming up from residual heat. Happened again yesterday once it hit around a quarter of a tank. Outside temp was probably 15-20 celcius, but bike had been running for approx 4 hours.

Cheers, Slob.

Just to lighten things up - yesterday.

Be sure the fuel tank VENT is OK. Had a very similar issue with a Honda back in the 70's. Open the fuel cap and all was well. It only happened when fuel level was 1/3 tank or less. Really doubt the tip over switch is causing this.

I'll double-check that, Clyde.

Thanks.

Beautiful pic, Slob!

Mike

turboslob said:

When I say hot, I mean the bike has been running for at least an hour straight. Seemingly (despite what the temp gauge says), after that time the fuel tank is warming up from residual heat. Happened again yesterday once it hit around a quarter of a tank. Outside temp was probably 15-20 celcius, but bike had been running for approx 4 hours.

Cheers, Slob.

Click to expand...

Your description is very interesting to me Turboslob as mine did exactly the same thing last Thursday under the same conditions.
It felt as if I was about to run out of fuel but I still had 4.5l/1Gallon in the tank (confirmed at fill-up 10km later).
The symptoms started about 10km/6 miles before a planned fuel/lunch stop and I was worried that I might not make it.
After filling up it did not do it again and has not done so during four more refills.

I did get a stick through the back tyre on the way home though.
Thank goodness for the TPMS! It warned me that the tyre was slowly deflating at about 1psi/10 minutes.
I was able to stop and refill the tyre several times to get me to my son's place in Canberra (250km away)and make a successful repair.
Without the TPMS I would most likely have been stuck out in the bush 30+km from the nearest help.
There is not even mobile phone signal where I was at the time and only a few farms.

Macka

turboslob said:

Just to lighten things up - yesterday.

Click to expand...

What a beautiful picture! Where in Australia was it taken?

I've got nearly 125,000 miles on my bike and regularly ride it in temps of 35-40C. I also regularly get down below 1/2 gal of gas left in the tank before refueling and have never had problems like you're describing. A couple of times when I was still riding one of my '99 Kawasaki Concours (called the GTR in Europe and the UK; don't know what they were called in Oz), I had something similar. Those bikes didn't have a fuel pump and I never was able to diagnose the cause of the problem. It must have been something with the vent and was resolved both times by simply opening the fuel cap.

That pic was taken near 'Brungle' NSW (I think).

Macka - interesting. Given it has done it to my bike three times last week (therefore a minimum of 900k of 'it' happening), I'm not expecting a sudden failure. For a bit of additional info, it's when you're using a bit of fuel (happened in lower gears when giving it 100%, or when trying to maintain 60mph/100km/h + in top). You just can't accelerate - much like it's hitting the rev limiter, but isn't.

I've bought the pump from Germany - should be here next week. Local dealer wanted around $800 - this pump was about $80 AUD. I'm off to Tassie soon and will keep it on me just in case.....and keep the tank topped up!

My fuel pump was replaced (under warranty) at 55,000 miles (90,000 kms) because it started making noises.
It never failed to pump correctly.

Dave

Mine makes a constant noise which you can easily hear when stopped with the engine running (high pitched sorta whine).

2006 model with 63000 kilometres.

turboslob said:

That pic was taken near 'Brungle' NSW (I think).

Macka - interesting. Given it has done it to my bike three times last week (therefore a minimum of 900k of 'it' happening), I'm not expecting a sudden failure. For a bit of additional info, it's when you're using a bit of fuel (happened in lower gears when giving it 100%, or when trying to maintain 60mph/100km/h + in top). You just can't accelerate - much like it's hitting the rev limiter, but isn't.

I've bought the pump from Germany - should be here next week. Local dealer wanted around $800 - this pump was about $80 AUD. I'm off to Tassie soon and will keep it on me just in case.....and keep the tank topped up!

Click to expand...

My symptoms were a bit different.
I was using moderate throttle at mid-range revs (3-4000) and just more or less cruising but it was a VERY nice, smooth road with lots of quick left-right switches.
Perhaps it was just fuel "surge" as it has not done it since over 4 or 5 later fill-ups.

This is one of my favourite roads but is about 400km from home. If anyone is interested, have a look at the link below.
Remember that we drive on the Left (correct side) here! :tongue:

https://www.google.com.au/maps/@-35.9973894,147.3559687,3a,75y,3.97h,90t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sW-JFH4zN7IXmvMk3CVuFNg!2e0!6s//geo2.ggpht.com/cbk?panoid=W-JFH4zN7IXmvMk3CVuFNg&output=thumbnail&cb_client=maps_sv.tactile.gps&thumb=2&w=203&h=100&yaw=80.93373&pitch=0&thumbfov=100!7i3328!8i1664

OFF TOPIC
I forgot to mention that I passed within a stones-throw (literally) of Brundle last Friday on my way to Bathurst.
It is pretty country, in parts, but some of it is very dry too.
There are serious worries about scrub fires in the coming Summer months.
It has been so dry that we have already had hundreds of fires during the "record hot Winter" and early Spring.
Many of the Northern parts of the country have had temperatures of 44C DURING WINTER.
This is unheard of and is a serious worry.
Yesterday, in Spring, we had snow in our Southernmost State (Tasmania).

Macka

I did have a minor running problem with my NT when it was new and it was related the parking the bike in the sun on a very hot day. I was at an event so really didn't have my choice of where to park. When I went to depart 3-4 hours later, the engine took several tries to start and accelerated roughly. The Check Engine Light was ON. I stopped and opened the fuel cap but heard no sounds of air escaping or rushing in. When I turned the key back ON, and started the engine the Check Engine Light had cleared and the engine ran normally.

ps. problems with the ST1100's Bank Angle Sensor are ancient history from 12+ years ago so it's a long stretch to relate those ills to the NT700V. The Bank Angle Sensor is fitted to all models that have fuel injection which is most Honda street bikes .

The NT has a sealed fuel system due to the requirement of evaporative emissions, thus you will not find a vented fuel cap ala the older bikes from days gone by.

Mike