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Thread: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

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    Brillot2000's Avatar
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    Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    Is there anyone out there that give an idea how the flasher unit works on this bike.

    This is what I gathered from reviewing the wiring diagram:

    Specialize unit unique to this bike only.
    There are at least 8 wires going into this unit.
    Fully Electronic with no mechanical moving parts.
    Both the front and rear signals are connected directly to this unit.
    Flasher Unit converts only both the front single filament bulbs into dual intensity bulbs.

    I want to know the following:

    Can I use LED bulbs with this unit?
    Is there a way to get Hazard/4-Way Lights to function with this unit?

    If some knows anything about this unit, please share the information that you have. It will also enable me to move onto the next stage regarding this matter. I will greatly appreciate it.

    Thank you in advance.
    Bruce B.
    Sun Valley, CA
    2010 NT700V - NaTalie

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    Moderator RedLdr1's Avatar
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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    See Here for the info I found when swapping out the OEM unit for a Kisan unit...
    Wayne
    1987 Yamaha FJ1200
    AMA Life Member

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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    I am pleased that I was able to the crack the code with the operation of the stock flasher unit and using it for Hazard/4-Ways Lights.

    Here's what has to be done to get this to work. (For simplicity I made my connections directly at the flasher unit):

    Grey Wire to both the Lt Blue and Orange Wires.

    Once all these wires are connected together then all will blink simultaneously. I also found out that the front lights will stay in the Running Light Mode/Low Intensity when they flash.

    IMG_8826[1].jpg

    IMG_8830[1].jpg

    I so found out the signal switch assembly wires are located behind the left body panel vent. That will be more convenient to make my connections to add a 4-way switch. I will be adding extension cables to both the 4-pin and 6-pin connectors and I will be splicing into those instead of the OEM Harness.

    I also found out that turn signal bulbs are in the European BAU15 Base Standards. There are plenty of LED options available on Amazon. I will be purchasing a full set here soon and will be installing them.

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    Moderator RedLdr1's Avatar
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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    Quote Originally Posted by Brillot2000 View Post
    I also found out that turn signal bulbs are in the European BAU15 Base Standards. There are plenty of LED options available on Amazon. I will be purchasing a full set here soon and will be installing them.
    Watch the LED bulb's resistance. Someone else here tried LED's a while back and had to add ballast resistors to get the flash rate correct...

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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    Quote Originally Posted by RedLdr1 View Post
    Watch the LED bulb's resistance. Someone else here tried LED's a while back and had to add ballast resistors to get the flash rate correct...
    This is not my first rodeo with LEDs. I designed and manufactured LED Lighting Products used on vehicles for nearly 15 years.

    It's not the LED Bulbs resistance that affects the flash rate, its the current draw. A typical incandescent bulb draws about 2.5 Amps each. LED replacements will draw far less. That's where run into the Hyper Flash.

    If this all leads me to nowhere or I am not happy with the results. I have a few other tricks up my sleeve that I can try using off-the-shelf components available at Autozone to get me a simple flashing turn signal and Hazard Lights for less than the cost of the Kisan SM-3R for $120. I do like the front lights as Running Lights though, I could live without them.

    It escapes me way Honda did not use an 1157 dual filament bulb instead of getting a single filament to act as a dual filament to get two intensities. I was trying to do the same thing like this when I was back in college with one of my bikes at the time. I do not recall that I got it right. I do recall that I did have something that somewhat worked at that time.


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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    I'm not so sure that you will find an LED replacement for the turn signal bulbs. First, how did Honda reduce the incandescent bulbs brightness? Is it an actual voltage reduction or a pulse width modulation scheme? Incandescent bulbs are ideal for either approach, but LED's, not so much. I have been tempted a time or two to determine how Honda accomplished this but have been too lazy to apply myself. Let me know if you have figured it out. I also wonder why Honda didn't take the easy 1157 way out.

    Mike
    "tis better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt...." Mark Twain

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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    Quote Originally Posted by mikesim View Post
    I'm not so sure that you will find an LED replacement for the turn signal bulbs. First, how did Honda reduce the incandescent bulbs brightness? Is it an actual voltage reduction or a pulse width modulation scheme? Incandescent bulbs are ideal for either approach, but LED's, not so much. I have been tempted a time or two to determine how Honda accomplished this but have been too lazy to apply myself. Let me know if you have figured it out. I also wonder why Honda didn't take the easy 1157 way out.

    Mike
    I actually found several on Amazon. These are my best picks based on my experience with LEDs.

    Option 1: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...A2HOOKPEX3GKZL

    Option 2: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...A17977WB0MUT0S

    Using and LED to get a lower intensity would be depenant on how the circuit to drive the LED was configured. If only resistors are used, then it is an easy task. If there's a driver circuit is used with a range of operation, then no it would not be possible.

    As mentioned I do not have my heart set on the Running Light feature and I can live without it if I have to.

    This bike has its roots in the European market, thus the reason the European bulbs were used in the turn signals.

    I also installed these LEDs into the brake light for about $20 for the set. Philips Ultinon LED 1157RULRX2

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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    It looks like option one is your best bet if Honda chose a voltage reduction scheme as it has a wide operating voltage and a 360 degree LED array. I'm still not sure however that LED's will function properly if a pulse width modulation scheme is being used.

    Mike

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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    Quote Originally Posted by mikesim View Post
    It looks like option one is your best bet if Honda chose a voltage reduction scheme as it has a wide operating voltage and a 360 degree LED array. I'm still not sure however that LED's will function properly if a pulse width modulation scheme is being used.

    Mike
    We will see if they can. If it does not, I always have Plan B doing the EP35 Flasher Conversion that I mentioned before.

    I did manage to complete my Hazard/4-ways conversion last night. Yesterday afternoon I went to All Electronics to buy all the supplies that I would need to do this conversion and a few other planned projects for this bike. They sell a variety of double-ended cable assemblies with the common connectors used on most Hondas. I bought an assortment of these cables. This project requried both the 4 conductor (CAT# CON-40) and 6 conductor (CAT# CON-60) cables that they sell. I used these cable plugged in between the left switch assembly and main wiring harness. I used these cables to make all my splices and left the OEM Harness alone. I mounted a pushbutton next the clutch lever perch and I will be making a more permanent solution to the mount the switch more firmly. For the time being, I zip tied it to the wires coming out of the left switch assembly.

    It works like a charm. As mentioned using the OEM Flasher Unit, the front lights transition from low to high intensity when engaged. I am alright this that for the time being.

    I will provide more information on the Hazard/4-Way Conversion at a later time. Perhaps some images too.

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    Re: Turn Signal Module - How Does It Work???

    Quote Originally Posted by mikesim View Post
    It looks like option one is your best bet if Honda chose a voltage reduction scheme as it has a wide operating voltage and a 360 degree LED array. I'm still not sure however that LED's will function properly if a pulse width modulation scheme is being used.

    Mike
    I was working on NaTalie over the weekend and had to take off the bodywork on the left side only. I measured the stock bulb height and found it to be about 50 mm and the hight output LED bulb that I mentioned on that dimension is 60 mm. I measured the depth of the front lens opening to the interier of lens and found out that bulb would collide with the lens. However, it could be used in the rear lens without any issues. I think that I found a different LED Bulb that would work with the front lens without any issues. TUINCYN BAU15S 1156 7Amber LED Bulbs

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