Electric Harley Davidson Motorcycle

RedLdr1

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Someone at the MoCo has definitely been thinking outside the box. Harley is releasing an electric motorcycle :eek1: for customer field trails through select dealers. From what I've read this will not be a production bike but is being used to gauge interest in electric motorcycles and elicit potential customer feedback. See Here for a very high level overview with lots of pictures and very little information...:rolleyes1:

I was just looking at a Zero SR 11.4 electric bike yesterday afternoon while wandering around WOW Motorcycles, maybe Zero will have some competition soon...:)
 

Warren

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I take back everything bad I said about them. The picture I saw it didn't even look like a cruiser. More like a naked street fighter.
 
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RedLdr1

RedLdr1

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I applaud them for doing this, but I wonder if it's only because Zero Motorcycles are becoming more practical with the extended range, and the price gap is narrowing too.
Unfortunately Zero still isn't where they need to be, at least for me... To get that extended range, and power, you have to get the bigger battery pack version that I was looking at yesterday. That "upgrade" put the Zero at just a few dollars shy of $15K which is more than I'm willing to pay for a 130 mile range. Optioning in the the The Z-Force? Power Tank which adds another 2.8kWh and extends the range to 170 miles extended the price to just under $18K! :eek1: That is too much more expensive than a comparable mid size bike, without the range issues, to get me to buy in... But I keep looking and hoping that with improved battery technology range will improve and the price will start declining as well....
 
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RedLdr1

RedLdr1

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170 miles per charge is a big improvement over just a couple of years ago.
Yes it is. I read somewhere Yamaha is supposed to be considering bringing out an electric bike as well. If a couple of the bigger manufactures start getting serious about electric bikes that may help drive improving the battery technology.
 

Rob

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I like that HD is dipping their foot in the pool. I wonder if they're actually sinking money into R&D and making it themselves or just outsourcing the whole thing. Or maybe half the bike is made by Zero or something.

I want an electric scooter!
 
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RedLdr1

RedLdr1

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I wonder if they're actually sinking money into R&D and making it themselves or just outsourcing the whole thing.
I wondered that as well... If you look at the FAQ tab you'll see:

Begin quote:

"Is Harley-Davidson? hiring EV engineers?

We are looking for experienced EV engineers who share the pioneering spirit of the four young founders who started this company more than a century ago by putting a motor in a bicycle frame. If you?d like to be part of this new journey and you?re passionate about motorcycling, we would love to talk to you about joining our team. Click the link below to see the opportunities we have available." http://jobs.harley-davidson.com/go/Electrical-Engineer-Jobs/330190/

:End Quote

So they are hiring EV folks... Of course you need some engineers on staff even if you do outsource parts of the project...
 

Bear

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Good for H-D! The bike looks nice, but they will have to do some catching up. They had a blurb on CNN about the new H-D and the only problem they had was that the bike only had a range of 57 miles per charge. They did say that it would blow the doors off a 'Vette in a quarter mile. The new Zero has a range of 170 miles.
 

DirtFlier

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I'm curious to see what sort of riders this H-D E-bike attracts. Because of the short range it will have to be someone who commutes or typically rides fairly close to home. Also because of the penchant of "The Motor Company" to cling to old technology, such as air cooled engines, they don't exactly have a reputation for leading edge technology. This is not to say, they don't do well because they probably sell every bike they build at premium prices plus have a huge and faithful following.

The potential customer of their E-bike, if it is ever mass produced, will have to be someone quite different.
 
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Harley is allowing people to Pre-order the LiveWire now from only select dealerships. HD Live Wire Pre-Order. $29.8k for a motorcycle is a lot of dough. If you ask me.

I owned a 2015 Zero SR, which was about $21k out the door with the extended battery pack and an additional quick charger. The bike only lasted me 2 years and 23k miles of daily commuting before the battery packs required replacement. The replacements "Blew Up" one month after they were installed. That bike was a complete "LEMON". Zero bought the bike back from me and I managed to get 80% of the purchase price back.


Quite honestly, I'd rather wait for either Honda or Yamaha to come out with an electric bike before I would try electric again.
 

DirtFlier

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Harley's E-bike has been around for 3-5 years as various prototypes were shown to the public, mainly to gauge customer appeal. It is clearly a non-traditional Harley and I have to wonder if they'll need to open small stores in key metro cities, perhaps in a mall, staffed with younger people who are more attuned to the electronic age and can talk the lingo? And I was shocked at the MSRP of nearly $30K!

I have several close riding friends who work/teach at Ohio State University (OSU). For at least 5 years, they've had a motorcycle E-racer project open to all students, whether they were EE majors or not. They won their class twice at the Isle of Man and competed successfully at Pike's Peak. Harley and various battery makers have plucked people out of that program. Amazingly, at least to me, a lot of those students don't ride or even have a driver's license but that's the new wave of kids these days.

http://org.osu.edu/buckeyecurrent/bikes/
 

mikesim

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I may be wrong (and frequently am, ask my wife), but I just don't think HD will sell very many at 29K a pop.

Mike
 
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RedLdr1

RedLdr1

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I may be wrong (and frequently am, ask my wife), but I just don't think HD will sell very many at 29K a pop.
I'm inclined to agree with you... But then I never believed Tesla would sell as many of those overpriced toys as they have either....:rolleyes:
 
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Tesla is a status symbol for people who also would buy high priced BMW, Mercedes, etc. The Live Wire has to get people who don't ride into the showroom, which I do not think will happen.
 

Warren

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I am not sure who the customer is that Harley thinks will be interested in this type of expensive high performance electric motorcycle. It does not appear to me that it is the eco friendly person that is interested in reducing their carbon footprint. If someone came out with a budget electric motorcycle designed for commuting, riding to class and short trips to the store that could be recharged on normal house current it might have a better chance than a high performance electric motorcycle. I have noticed that electric bicycles around the world are doing quite well. On the other hand I am not sure that very many Americans see anything on two wheels as anything more than a recreational vehicle regardless of its power plant.
 
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If someone came out with a budget electric motorcycle designed for commuting, riding to class and short trips to the store that could be recharged on normal house current it might have a better chance than a high performance electric motorcycle.
Do not be fooled into buying a Zero. Yes, they are more affordable compared to the LiveWire MSRP. However, me being a former owner and knowing a former coworker owning one at the same time as I did. The Zero is not ready to "Go Live" and needs a lot more development before they would be a reliable solution. Zero does not have the resources to do all the required reliability testing before releasing the product to the public, so they let the owners be their product testers. Both my buddy and my experiences with our bikes were very similar, the quality and support network was seriously lacking.

My Zero only had a port for a 120 VAC wall outlet cord and could be also used with 240 VAC where available with the correct cord type. It took 4-6 hours to charge only using this port for my 30-mile commute to work. Using the added Quick Charger that Zero sold got the charge times to half those estimates. If the battery was flat dead, it took 12-16 hours to charge using only the onboard charger. The range I was getting was between 80-85 miles on a charge ridden on the freeways going between 70-80 MPH. You could not go on long rides on this bike. You had to map your route mileage closely to ensure you had enough charge to get back.
 
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Electric bikes/vehicles certainly get me curious but so far that is all.
The range is a real problem. $30,000 with limited range/uses would really stop me looking at them much.
It is still too experimental and new in development to be useful for the majority at this point.

Brad
 
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Electric bikes/vehicles certainly get me curious but so far that is all.
The range is a real problem. $30,000 with limited range/uses would really stop me looking at them much.
It is still too experimental and new in development to be useful for the majority at this point.

Brad
When the Zero was behaving itself, it was quite enjoyable. My commute to work was nearly 30 miles, I could have ridden there and back on a single charge. My employer had EV Chargers installed, so I took advantage of them every day. Yes, there was some range anxiety, in the beginning, however, I took the same route every day and the occasional side trips having enough charge to get me home with much to spare. It saved me over $900 per year on gasoline using the average of $20 per week getting to and from work.

Do not get me wrong, an electric vehicle has its niche. An electric motorcycle was quite economical for me as my employer was paying for one part of my trip daily. I also have a Solar System on my home, which would generate more energy during the day used to charge the bike in the evenings. Basically, it cost me nothing to ride during those 2 years.

The headaches that the bike gave me was purely on Zero. I am sure that either Honda, Yamaha, or Kawasaki could have done better and will do a better job on a bike of this type than Zero did. As for Harley, only time will say how they did on this bike. I am sure that sales will be slow in the beginning. Once the demand and production go up, the price will start to drop. Don't expect the price to drop below $25k in the near future.

I do plan on revisiting an electric motorcycle again in the future, just not a Zero ever again. I am looking forward to the time that Japan can remove the bad taste that Zero had left in my mouth.


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I may be wrong (and frequently am, ask my wife), but I just don't think HD will sell very many at 29K a pop.

Mike
Which will prompt them to say, "See, we told you so." and continue to sell 1919 technology at 2119 prices.
 

DirtFlier

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I wish them well but it'll be a steep uphill climb. Electric cars have just now caught on but I'd guess that 95-98% of car buyers still prefer something that mostly burns fossil fuel or a hybrid of some sort. A $29k all-electric motorcycle will not be an easy sell and certainly to someone other than the "traditional" H-D buyer. And I'm sure most of the H-D dealers will not be happy about electric bikes being shipped to them, like it or not. Just look at how they accepted Buell!
 
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