Lithium Iron

[karl]

There was talk about Lithium batteries in the "other" forum and I came across this:
http://www.shoraipower.com/t-faq.aspx
Seems interesting the web site has issues but there is some interesting reading there.
My bike came with a YUASA YTZ14S the sites finders did not work for me just poking around led me to believe that I could save some weight but not much room.

 

[elizilla]

There was a vendor selling these at the motorcycle show today. Tom and Bessonguy got more details, I think. Maybe one of them will post what they learned?

 

[karl]

Does give you the "ability" to haul some more stuff...

 

[karl]

And another
http://www.super-b.com/

 

[karl]

Speed cost money, how fast do you want to go... LOL. Cheap they are not. That much is certain.

 

[karl]

Lets not go there...

 

[Tom]

When we talked to their rep at the Novi, MI show he claimed the main advantage other than weight was that the battery would hold it,s charge "7 times longer" than other batteries. It only comes in two sizes and the box it comes in has material to make up the difference. He claimed it would compare in price to other battery,s on the market but I never looked into it. From what I am reading here that may not be true but I have never looked into it my self. It was very light. Could you please comment further on the cold weather discharge problem. Thanks, Tom

 

[BessonGuy]

I spoke to the guy the same time as Tom did. When they tell you everything is better or comparable to the existing technology, at a similar price point, they can't be totally trusted. Alternatives pretty much always have some downsides or they would become the new normal. So the usual question is do the benefits outweight the downsides. I haven't heard unbiased evaluations of this technology yet to make that conclusion. Has MCN done a review?? My $0.02.

But I still think they sound interesting and would consider buying one for my 230 dualsport.

Don

 

[elizilla]

One of the cells in the Super10's OEM battery went bad. (I don't think it's a bike-specific issue. Some percentage of batteries simply go bad quickly and I just got unlucky.) Since I had installed a lot of electrical farkles which I would have to remove if I wanted to take the bike back and make a warranty claim, and that would be a nuisance, I decided to just buy my own replacement battery. I bought the Shorai LiFe battery. That was in November.

We have had a mild winter here and I've gotten out on the bike a lot more than usual. I have taken it out repeatedly, in temps just above, just at, or just below freezing. The Shorai battery has worked fine every time I have started the bike.

It does have a different characteristic; the cranking is different. It starts out slightly on the weak side. I would expect a traditional battery that sounded slightly weak like that, to quickly get more weak, and die. But the Shorai battery gets stronger and the bike starts right up.

I have a Signal Dynamics voltmeter. It has a single LED that changes color. When the LED is green, it's fully charged. Yellow is marginal, red is bad, flashing red is terrible. It has a little startup sequence where it takes several seconds to cycle through all the colors. It finishes cycling and goes briefly to red, then turns yellow. This is true even when the heated handgrips are on. I crank the bike and it fires right up, and the light goes green immediately.

The Shorai folks say that their batteries need to warm up, and if they aren't cranking hard enough to start the bike, leave it sit with the headlights on for a couple of minutes and this will warm the battery up and it will crank better. I can see this in action - it is true. It feels counterintuitive now, but I suspect it will feel perfectly normal once I've had more time to get used to it.

 

[charlie b]

They are correct, Lithium batteries need to be a bit warmer. Have used LiIon, LiPo, and LiFe batteries a lot (you probably have too, just don't realize it). The best thing is they can sit and hold charge for a LONG time, months.

When they are cold their output current drops (internal resistance goes high). Like Shorai said, a bit of current draw will warm them (decreases internal resistance) and they can then put out full current. It is odd to have a battery that seems to get stronger the more you crank the motor.

When I need to replace my battery I'll look for one of these.

FWIW, all my portable tools are now lithium too

 

[Mellow]

leave it sit with the headlights on for a couple of minutes and this will warm the battery up and it will crank better.

On the S10, the lights don't come on unless the bike is running so how does that work? Maybe the fuel pump, computer, ind lights and turn sig/running lights is enough draw?

 

[elizilla]

On the S10, the lights don't come on unless the bike is running so how does that work? Maybe the fuel pump, computer, ind lights and turn sig/running lights is enough draw?

They seem to, so far. But if it were cold enough that I needed more, I have heated grips I can run.

 

[Mellow]

LOL.. it just defies logic... LOL

Hey, my battery is dead, let me turn on all my stuff.. LOL

 

[garwil]

Lead acid batteries have a similar problem, except it does not become an issue until well below freezing. When I lived in Yellowknife, Northwest Territories, all the cars had a battery blanket. The Lead Acid battery will not take a charge until they are warm, so when it is -40f, the alternator only warms the battery, but does not add to the charge. With a battery blanket (little heating pad that wraps around the battery), it keeps the battery warm enough that the alternator can charge it, and warm enough that it will put out a charge and crank the motor. With modern fuel injection and 100% synthetic oil, it is possible to crank and start a motor without a block heater, but you still needed to provide heat to the battery to keep it functional.

One of the tricks when the battery is a little cold is to crank it for a few seconds, and then let it rest for ten or fifteen seconds. After a few cycles, the battery would warm itself enough to crank and start the motor.

 

[Rmcapozzi]

A heated blanket sounds like something I would want on me never mind the battery at -40F. Yikes that is cold!!!

Lead acid batteries have a similar problem, except it does not become an issue until well below freezing. When I lived in Yellowknife, Northwest Territories, all the cars had a battery blanket. The Lead Acid battery will not take a charge until they are warm, so when it is -40f, the alternator only warms the battery, but does not add to the charge. With a battery blanket (little heating pad that wraps around the battery), it keeps the battery warm enough that the alternator can charge it, and warm enough that it will put out a charge and crank the motor. With modern fuel injection and 100% synthetic oil, it is possible to crank and start a motor without a block heater, but you still needed to provide heat to the battery to keep it functional.

One of the tricks when the battery is a little cold is to crank it for a few seconds, and then let it rest for ten or fifteen seconds. After a few cycles, the battery would warm itself enough to crank and start the motor.

 

[karl]

I won't ride my bike at -40...

 

[ARKNT]

I won't ride my bike at -40...

Me neither. Afraid the tires would shatter into little pieces.

Brad