Battery Paranoia

Coyote Chris · Jul 6, 2023

I purchased my left over 2015 VFR in late 2019.
Before going touring, I always check my battery static voltage and see how it does on my 100 amp discharge resistive battery checker.
I am touring WY in 2 weeks.
The test came back fine. 12.7v.....10 volts and steady as a rock discharge test under major load for 10 seconds. Rebounding to 12.6. Bike starts fine.

I got to looking at the battery. Its only thing that indicates a code date is "190223" I suspect the dealer put in a new battery in 2019 when I bought the bike.
These gel cells are cheep and all over the web for $35. They are easy to get to and in and out. So I decided to just replace it.

Is this being paranoid? Since I carry a jump pack, maybe I am just a worry wart. I have experienced Goldwing Itis catistrophic battery failure 3 times and Also had Frosty's batterry go eadd on a trip.

Mellow · Jul 6, 2023

Some get 8 years out of a battery.. or more.. I think if it tests good then it's good... but, as soon as I say that it will die on your trip lol Now you have a test battery for playing with bike accessories.

Hondafan · Jul 6, 2023

I looked that battery up, and it is an AGM battery, not a gel cell. AGM batteries have a longer life span so are a better choice for motorcycles.

mikesim · Jul 6, 2023

Coyote Chris said:
Is this being paranoid? Since I carry a jump pack, maybe I am just a worry wart. I have experienced Goldwing Itis catistrophic battery failure 3 times and Also had Frosty's batterry go eadd on a trip.

You??!! Paranoid??!! You??!! Worry Wart??!! Pshaw!! What could possibly ever give you THAT idea>??!!
:rofl1:

Mike

Yoda · Jul 6, 2023

Easy solution: I’ve never replaced a battery in any bike.
I don’t keep them long enough! LOL

Coyote Chris · Jul 7, 2023

Hondafan said:
I looked that battery up, and it is an AGM battery, not a gel cell. AGM batteries have a longer life span so are a better choice for motorcycles.

OK, so the dealer stuck in an AGM? That is interesting that is says it should NOT becharged at a high rate and should be charged at 1 amp....Anyway, I have a $35 gel cell coming. It will be interesting to compare the voltage drop under load.

Northeast Battery | Blog | AGM vs. GEL

Should you use AGM or GEL batteries if you live in cold climates? And which technology lasts longer? Find out everything about AGM and GEL batteries here!

northeastbattery.com

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Hondafan · Jul 7, 2023

I use an Optimate 4 charger. It varies the amperage as it charges and tops out at 1 amp.

mikesim · Jul 7, 2023

Coyote Chris said:
OK, so the dealer stuck in an AGM? That is interesting that is says it should NOT becharged at a high rate and should be charged at 1 amp....Anyway, I have a $35 gel cell coming. It will be interesting to compare the voltage drop under load.

Northeast Battery | Blog | AGM vs. GEL

Should you use AGM or GEL batteries if you live in cold climates? And which technology lasts longer? Find out everything about AGM and GEL batteries here!

northeastbattery.com

.

In looking at your link, it appears that for your application, the AGM is the obvious choice and the gel would be a poor choice for the bike.

Mike

junglejim · Jul 7, 2023

mikesim said:
In looking at your link, it appears that for your application, the AGM is the obvious choice and the gel would be a poor choice for the bike.

Mike

NOW you tell him, after he’s ordered the gel cell

mikesim · Jul 7, 2023

junglejim said:
NOW you tell him, after he’s ordered the gel cell

He shoulda asked before he bought the battery! Seriously, I don't recall seeing a comparison between the two before. I hear people all the time call an AGM battery a gel cell because it too is spillproof. The OE manufacturers have been using AGM batteries for some time now so that's what I have been using to replace my batteries when needed. Most OE auto makers are now using AGM's as well for their superior performance. BMW cars even takes it to extremes (nuthin' new there...). On certain models, when the battery is replaced it MUST be an AGM and after replacement, the car must be taken to a BMW dealer for battery "registration". The registration process involves hooking up the car to the diagnostic equipment and learning the "charging profile" of the battery. Only after the battery has been registered will the ECU keep the battery charged correctly without damaging the charging system.

BMW battery registering & programming explained - BIMMERtips.com

Mike

DirtFlier · Jul 8, 2023

Since around 1995, I've only used AGM batteries in my street bikes. No big deal and I see no reason to try something else.

karl · Jul 8, 2023

One of the things I did at work was work on the battery powered material handling equipment. Flooded lead acid stuff had to get charged in a special highly ventilated room. The 480v chargers could add juice pretty quick and were supposed to get a weekly or equalizing charge. Gell cells had to be charged much slower as off gassing would tunnel the gel and ruin the battery. Absorbed Glass Mat batteries will tolerate a high rate of charge but are happier with a lower rate. Have had some AGM's last ten years with a bit of care. Heat and discharge too low will kill them.

Coyote Chris · Jul 8, 2023

OK, while waiting for the new battery, I charged up my "original" and let it sit for 3 days. 12.6 static volts on the bench. I then put on my resistive battery checker and held the switch for 5 seconds. The volts dropped to 10.79 and stayed there. After 3 min, the battery static charge rebounded to 12.6. The CTZ12S (BS) can be had for $54-$99 on the web. Once I get the gel cell, I may just put it into my electric start push mower if it doesnt preform well. And by the AGM..,.,now on sale $54

Coyote Chris · Jul 8, 2023

BTW, in the world of Fire Power, the CTZ12 s-BS designation means you have to fill the battery yourself and it is called "Maintenance Free" $57 Factory code 49-2294
"Factory activated" just has the standard CTZ-12s designation. No bottles. $73 and up. Factory code 49-2287

Coyote Chris · Jul 8, 2023

OK, gonna have some fun...(after replacing 40 year old garage door extension springs with new double loop end ones with safety cables I need some fun) Just bought over the web a new CTZ12 S Firepower. $73. Best web price. List $99. Will use the new one during the summer and trickle charge it now and again in the winter in the basement and put in the old one for storage....check the performance over three years....

DirtFlier · Jul 9, 2023

"...check the performance over three years..."

Isn't that just a tiny bit obsessive?

I put a note on the battery stating the installation date and let it go at that...done.

mikesim · Jul 9, 2023

Coyote Chris said:
BTW, in the world of Fire Power, the CTZ12 s-BS designation means you have to fill the battery yourself and it is called "Maintenance Free" $57 Factory code 49-2294
"Factory activated" just has the standard CTZ-12s designation. No bottles. $73 and up. Factory code 49-2287

Both batteries may be AGMs. There are several brands that come with the acid pack that requires you to install the acid yourself. The battery is manufactured with the fiberglass mats between the plates. The owner installs the electrolyte and then seals the battery with the sealing caps. It then becomes the functional equivalent of a factory activated battery. The reason for this approach is shelf life. Once a battery is activated with electrolyte self discharging begins at a rate of 1-2% per month and lead sulfate begins to accumulate at the base of the plates. It may sit for quite a long time at the retailer before being placed into service thus it is already somewhat weakened even though it is new to the buyer. A good retailer monitors his batteries and periodically (every six months) refreshes his batteries with a trickle charge and returns them to like new performance. The battery that is owner filled with electrolyte is truly new out of the box.

Mike

Coyote Chris · Jul 9, 2023

mikesim said:
Both batteries may be AGMs. There are several brands that come with the acid pack that requires you to install the acid yourself. The battery is manufactured with the fiberglass mats between the plates. The owner installs the electrolyte and then seals the battery with the sealing caps. It then becomes the functional equivalent of a factory activated battery. The reason for this approach is shelf life. Once a battery is activated with electrolyte self discharging begins at a rate of 1-2% per month and lead sulfate begins to accumulate at the base of the plates. It may sit for quite a long time at the retailer before being placed into service thus it is already somewhat weakened even though it is new to the buyer. A good retailer monitors his batteries and periodically (every six months) refreshes his batteries with a trickle charge and returns them to like new performance. The battery that is owner filled with electrolyte is truly new out of the box.

Mike

True Story. And both are AGMs. These are made in Boise. I will note the date on the new one. I think I need a chart for my six vehicles on when I bought the batteries and how they are doing. Jump pack batteries are lith ion and seem to last about 3 years at the level I want them.

mikesim · Jul 9, 2023

Coyote Chris said:
True Story. And both are AGMs. These are made in Boise. I will note the date on the new one. I think I need a chart for my six vehicles on when I bought the batteries and how they are doing. Jump pack batteries are lith ion and seem to last about 3 years at the level I want them.

A battery made in Boise? I'm impressed! The more stuff we can make here in the US the better off we will be.

Mike

Coyote Chris · Jul 10, 2023

mikesim said:
A battery made in Boise? I'm impressed! The more stuff we can make here in the US the better off we will be.

Mike

I agree. and as luck would have it, I think the replacement for the VFR will drop right into my Vstrom. Which also hasnt had a new battery since I bought it. The Vstrom battery is .8 taller normally but with lower cranking power... (!) Some high tech shims at the bottom of the wee strom should fix that....