Just joined wanted to say hello

All of the above about British winters is correct and yes we mostly ride them all year round .......I don’t mine is wrapped up in a blanket in the log cabin with the heater on I never take my bike out in the wet 😂😂
If you was to bring your ride over here it would dissolve within a week 🤣

I'll bet you're right on that Neal - YIKES!!

Pete
 
Out west, they put sand and gravel on the roads during the winter. Some metro areas use a special deicer.....back in the mid west, they put millions of tons of salt on the roads. In the 1960s, cars would litterally rust out....there were undercoatings you could buy, , of course, that would delay the process but now IIRC there are more sophisticated undercoats put on at the factory.
 
Out west, they put sand and gravel on the roads during the winter. Some metro areas use a special deicer.....back in the mid west, they put millions of tons of salt on the roads. In the 1960s, cars would litterally rust out....there were undercoatings you could buy, , of course, that would delay the process but now IIRC there are more sophisticated undercoats put on at the factory.

Oh yes - even though the amount of salt used on the roads has gone up if anything, the incidence of really bad corrosion has greatly decreased.

When I was in high school, my buddy's Mom bought a brand new 1971 Ford Maverick with a three-speed manual. Within about 18-20 months, the cops pulled her off the road (at which point that car had about 14,000 miles lady-driven on it) and her issued a ticket that would force her to either have it repaired - or scrap the car.

She chose to donate it to our high school auto shop which had a whole bunch of old car engines on stands that were stripped down and re-assembled by students every year.....

....and oddly, late one evening, a few days later, (I was told - not having been there myself, of course), one of the old Ford 200 cu-in straight-six engines from a test stand found its way into the rusty hulk of the Maverick and the Maverick engine found its way into another friend's 62 Ford Falcon, while a third beat-up old straight-six was procured for the engine test stand.

Amazing the stuff you hear about if you listen carefully....;)
 
It's not just the bodywork -- the Deauville 650 was manufactured from '98-'05 with some major revisions happening in 2002. Its engine had 3 valves and 1 spark plug, 55hp and 41 ft/lb of torque. The Deauville 700 was introduced in 2006, and is the 3rd generation that is essentially like our bike (which, as far as I can tell, were all made in either 2009 or 2010, and marketed as 2010 and 2011 models, with some left-over '11s being sold as '12 models). The adjustable windshield was probably the biggest change during the life of the NT700V. At some point it went from 2 positions to our 5-position version. There were a lot more accessories sold in the UK (and Europe) than Honda ever made available here. It's too bad that it wasn't marketed very well in the US and, apparently, didn't fit the desires of the American market. It was perceived as being overpriced, but compared to its competition, by the time you modified them to have the touring features of the NT, it wasn't that far off IMNSHO.

The biggest upgrade from the 650 to 700 was the move from carburetors to Honda's PGM-FI (electronic fuel injection).
 
Oh yes - even though the amount of salt used on the roads has gone up if anything, the incidence of really bad corrosion has greatly decreased.

When I was in high school, my buddy's Mom bought a brand new 1971 Ford Maverick with a three-speed manual. Within about 18-20 months, the cops pulled her off the road (at which point that car had about 14,000 miles lady-driven on it) and her issued a ticket that would force her to either have it repaired - or scrap the car.

She chose to donate it to our high school auto shop which had a whole bunch of old car engines on stands that were stripped down and re-assembled by students every year.....

....and oddly, late one evening, a few days later, (I was told - not having been there myself, of course), one of the old Ford 200 cu-in straight-six engines from a test stand found its way into the rusty hulk of the Maverick and the Maverick engine found its way into another friend's 62 Ford Falcon, while a third beat-up old straight-six was procured for the engine test stand.

Amazing the stuff you hear about if you listen carefully....;)
You can hear alot just by listening!
 
This Deauville is the next best bike similar to the Pan just that bit smaller and more manageable
Yep the NT is taking on...
Riding ST1100's since '92,I recently upgraded my GF from a Kawa ER-5 to an NT700VA to be better suited for our tours... and she likes it a lot...
A friend of mine now also got himself an NT700VA, his ST1300 is growing a bit heavy...
 
ACF-50 is used a lot in the UK. I have seen videos where it is used to fog a complete motorcycle with just the brakes and tires covered. I have used it on occasion mostly for high corrosion areas on my NT and I did ride it all year rain or shine. When I traded it in after 10 years all the metal parts were still corrosion free. It’s also used a lot with aircraft and it’s made in Canada.
 
ACF-50 is used a lot in the UK. I have seen videos where it is used to fog a complete motorcycle with just the brakes and tires covered. I have used it on occasion mostly for high corrosion areas on my NT and I did ride it all year rain or shine. When I traded it in after 10 years all the metal parts were still corrosion free. It’s also used a lot with aircraft and it’s made in Canada.
You are correct on this most owners over here in the uk treat there bikes once a year with this product
 
Hi Neal, I have a few sport tourers in the garage, 1st and 2nd gen Concours's, an FJR, a RT along with a big k12lt that the wife will only get on . Since the 700 came into my possession, aside from the very occasional morning to mid afternoon fun ride with wife on the LT, the other bikes have seen zero miles. I just love this 700. After all its little niggles were worked out after it came home with me, its turned into really the only bike that I really need.... or should I say want to ride. I totally get the need to get on a lighter bike which is why I snapped up my 700. It checks off just about all the boxes and the box that it doesn't check off I can totally live with. Pound some miles on that bike and keep us posted!
 
Hi Neal, I have a few sport tourers in the garage, 1st and 2nd gen Concours's, an FJR, a RT along with a big k12lt that the wife will only get on . Since the 700 came into my possession, aside from the very occasional morning to mid afternoon fun ride with wife on the LT, the other bikes have seen zero miles. I just love this 700. After all its little niggles were worked out after it came home with me, its turned into really the only bike that I really need.... or should I say want to ride. I totally get the need to get on a lighter bike which is why I snapped up my 700. It checks off just about all the boxes and the box that it doesn't check off I can totally live with. Pound some miles on that bike and keep us posted!
Hi mate I see you have the lower fairing kit on yours which covers up all your exhaust downpipe and the engine side casings this is the one I’ve ordered on EBay as previously mentioned
I think they look real good makes the bike appear bigger .Mine will be painted gloss black that is how it comes
If you look at the picture of mine at the start of the thread you will see I have done my panniers in gloss back.I was going to repaint the kit in the original champagne gold which is the main colour of my bike
But am hoping the black on the kit won’t look to bad and will save me a job
 
Hi mate I see you have the lower fairing kit on yours which covers up all your exhaust downpipe and the engine side casings this is the one I’ve ordered on EBay as previously mentioned
I think they look real good makes the bike appear bigger .Mine will be painted gloss black that is how it comes
If you look at the picture of mine at the start of the thread you will see I have done my panniers in gloss back.I was going to repaint the kit in the original champagne gold which is the main colour of my bike
But am hoping the black on the kit won’t look to bad and will save me a job
Hey Sir! I wish that bike that you are looking at was mine but its not. Thats Coyote Chris's bike. Its absolutely beautiful full faired in that red. I'd love to do that to mine. I'd like to hear how you like yours and what kind of riding experience it gives over the stock non lower fairing ride.
 
Hey Sir! I wish that bike that you are looking at was mine but its not. Thats Coyote Chris's bike. Its absolutely beautiful full faired in that red. I'd love to do that to mine. I'd like to hear how you like yours and what kind of riding experience it gives over the stock non lower fairing ride.

Well, I'll chime in here. The red bike is not Coyote Chris's. He no longer has an NT. And that bike is an NT650V. Chris gets lots of pictures that he posts and he sometimes doesn't say where they came from. That's the case with this picture.

As far as painting the pannier lids black on an NT of a different color, it's something I like and have done in the past.

Here's a picture of my 1st '10 NT when I was on my Epic Ride back in '13.

P8280263 (2017_11_17 00_21_56 UTC) (3).JPG

A few days before this I had met up and ridden with Bear on his red NT that had black big lids.

P8250173 (2017_11_17 00_21_56 UTC) (2).JPG

I had painted mine because as painful as it is to admit it, I had a tendency to drop my bike. After buying a couple of sets of big lids (and selling my old scratched up ones ... in fact, it's possible, but it's too long ago for me to remember for sure, that Alex's nicely painted black lids are one of my old sets), I sanded my scraped up 3rd set with 80 grit sandpaper and painted it with Rustoleum Satin Black.

After riding a couple of '99 Kawasaki Concours that were a sorta' deep purple color and had the standard Concours black panniers, I thought (and still do) that black panniers were an "authentic sport-touring" look.
 
Well, I'll chime in here. The red bike is not Coyote Chris's. He no longer has an NT. And that bike is an NT650V. Chris gets lots of pictures that he posts and he sometimes doesn't say where they came from. That's the case with this picture.

I'm confused as well. He quoted my post about fuel injection and the response was just a random photo of a 650 with no context to why he quoted the post about PGM-FI. :confused1:
 
I'm confused as well. He quoted my post about fuel injection and the response was just a random photo of a 650 with no context to why he quoted the post about PGM-FI. :confused1:
You make the comment that the biggest difference between the two was injection. In my mind's eye, that was the least. I plead guilty to putting up a pic of a "ringer". But still, for beauty and beauty alone, I like the 650. For function, the 700, with big lids, wins hands down. Well, maybe except for pannier latches. ;)
a 650 red.jpg
 
You are EXACTLY right on the ST being too heavy. I sold one at a loss for just that reason.

ZACKLEY - me too. I sold my 2007 ST1300 just prior to Christmas and took quite a hit on it. The bike was in top-notch shape and everything worked perfectly. I just felt that the time was coming when 725 lbs would be too much and I wanted something lighter. I really wanted an NT700V but they were never offered for sale in Canada and I haven't been able to find a grey market bike during the pandemic.

....which is why I bought Gretel....

1983_R100RS-RH-front_dual.jpg
 
MaxPete, when I was getting ready to move on from my first bike, an '83 GL650i, a friend of mine told me that what I really needed was an airhead BMW. I couldn't find any I could afford in the fall of '98 and ended up buying a '99 Kawasaki Concours. I had two '99s for 165K miles before I bought my first '10 NT.

Tell me more about Gretel!
 
OK Phil, since you asked....this is a post that I put up on the XS650 Yamaha forum XS650.com when I decided to sell Sylvia - my 2007 ST1300. XS650.com is very similar to NT Owners and ST Owners but with some "extended" vocabulary permitted and a tiny bit of tasteful nudity here and there.....;)
__________________________________________________________________
Dear buddies:

Well, it is now time for me to reveal my latest love...Gretel. She is a big, buxom Bavarian - born in 1983 in Berlin in the heart of Prussia (so...like....she is....you know...German - in case you hadn't picked that up), and I have been lusting after her for more than 40 years.

She is a BMW R100RS which is IMO, one of the most beautiful motorcycles, or any type of vehicle, ever offered for sale to the general public. The R100RS was introduced in 1977 when I was 19 years old and I was totally smitten. When everyone else had posters of Farah Fawcett and Cheryl Tiegs on their walls (or bedroom ceilings....
:rolleyes:
:p ), I had a poster of a matt powder blue BMW R100RS on mine (the...wall, that is....needless to say).

When the RS model was introduced in 1977, I went to a BMW dealership in Ottawa, ON and walked in - simply captivated - and sat on their floor model. The salescreep came running over yelling at me about "ACHTUNG - no grubby students allowed to sit on the expensive German motorcycles - those are for wealthy gentlemen!!". While he was hustling me out the door, I pointed to the back of my jacket which said "Queen's Applied Science" and told him that meant "Engineering" and that some day I would be a wealthy gentleman - and I would be buying one of those bikes - but it sure as he!! wouldn't be from HIM! Unfortunately however, he was correct. The new-bike cost of the R100RS was about $7K CDN as I recall it, which was about four-five times the price of an XS650 (if not more) and was simply out of my reach as a starving student. Marriage, children, mortgages, education and other irrelevancies interfered in the interim - but after 43 years, I decided that while I may not be a "wealthy gentleman", I could afford to buck-up and buy my dream.

Gretel has gone about 95,115 km (around 59,000 miles) but these bikes are reputed to go 2-300,000 km before major work is needed. She actually has had a top-end refresh plus the frame has been powder coated and she has been repainted black and red. The colour scheme is, frankly, not my first choice, but the work has been done to a top-notch standard and it is growing on me. The blue & white BMW emblems are missing off the tank and the R100RS sidecover decals are missing too - but both are on their way so she will be complete soon. I have had new tires installed (interestingly, they are the same size as those on the XS650 Standards - a 3.50x19 on the front and a 4.00x18 on the rear) and there are zero leaks or stains on the engine or transmission cases. Her shaft drive rear end is dry and quiet and she rides like a dream at...well....pretty frickin' fast speeds.

She came to me very nicely equipped with both the usual dual and the relatively rare solo (actually 3/4 length) seat - both in mint condition, a tool kit, a complete spare exhaust system in solid condition with good chrome, a bunch of other spares and a very nice set of BMW (aka Krauser) bags with chrome brackets. She has air-assisted rear shocks which give a nice steady ride and she also has a beautiful leather Bagster tank cloak (see photo below) to which I can clip the very nice tank bag without risking a scratch on the tank. The one wrinkle is that I only have one key to the ignition and one key to each bag - and BMW key blanks are not easy to come-by - but I have a bunch of blank keys on order.

EDIT: after a trip to the locksmith I have several ignition keys and an epic search on the web has brought me a spare set of luggage keys.

TECHNICAL & RIDING IMPRESSIONS:
The 1000cc BMW airhead is obviously a big twin so she has a pleasant sort of thumpy exhaust note, not unlike an XS650 but she runs much smoother. She's no Gold Wing but vibration is, in my view, not a factor here.

The starting drill is about the same as an XS650: fuel - ON (two petcocks), choke - ON, hit the button (no kicker) and thumpity-thumpity....she is running. She cranks slowly, like a car - but she always goes and settles down to a nice idle at about 1000 RPM. The idle has a gentle side-to-side motion as the horizontally-opposed boxer engine pistons go in and out together - firing on alternate revolutions. She has a cartridge type oil filer ($7.95 USD) inside the RH side of the crankcase and a factory oilcooler in the fairing right behind the front wheel. The valve adjustments are even easier than on an XS650 - remove valve cover, loosen locknut and adjust the screw-type lash adjuster. Even doing the top-end rebuild is an easy (if somewhat expensive) task with no need to remove the engine from the frame (even for a lower-end job the engine can stay in as the crankshaft comes out through the front cover). In any event, the engine isn't that heavy, particularly if you separate the transmission first. She is sort of like a good sized garden tractor - definitely at the other end of the complication scale from the ST1300.

The electrical system is also pretty simple - no EFI, no electrically powered windscreen, no microprocessor-anything, no on-board galley, steerable headlight, variable valve-lift or cam-timing, no built-in cappuccino machine or entertainment systems. The alternator is adequate and it uses external excitation which requires carbon brushes, just like our XS650s (and upgrades to higher output PMA units are widely available for the heated gear crowd). Like the later XS650s, the 1980+ R100RS came with an electronic ignition system which is reportedly very reliable and since Gretel is an '83, I will not be messing with ignition points on her.

She has a fully synchromesh 5-speed gearbox which can be separated from the engine and removed - leaving the engine in the bike. The clutch is a dry single disc unit (again, just like a car), so there is no wet clutch drag at idle. The clutch pull is quite light and the controls, while a bit quirky, all come to hand easily and work just fine. The stock horns are pretty fearsome (twin Fiamms within the fairing) but, Germans do have a somewhat...shall we say, aggressive reputation in certain circles, for some reason. The Brembo brakes are good (triple disks - all drilled) and the suspension, while quite soft with a long travel, is well damped so you don't get the feeling that she is going to go wobbling off into some Alpine meadow for a yodeling session. The fuel economy is good - upwards of 50 MPImpG with the 40mm Bing CV carbs (very similar to our Mikunis on the Yamahas) and there is no bucking or hesitation anywhere in the RPM range.

Overall, you get the impression of a very well designed and built motorcycle that has been carefully tuned to work well at high speeds for long distances without any fuss. I am told that 100+ MPH all day is not a problem (at least for the bike....).

The first thing I noticed on sitting is that she is pretty tall. I am just under 6' and she is about as tall as I would be comfortable with. However, she is also quite light for a big motorcycle - around 503 lbs wet (around 50 lbs more than an XS650), which is more than 230 lbs less than my Honda ST1300. That huge weight difference could be a factor for me as I had a knee replacement last year and I ain't getting any younger or any taller. Right now, I can handle the ST1300, but someday.... The R100RS seating position is pretty low and forward (the bars are waayy out there and nearly flat) - but I am getting used to it.

The BMW airheads were built in several displacement classes (from 450 through 1000cc) for nearly 20 years and so many OEM parts are still available. In fact, the horizontally opposed boxer engine, dry clutch and shaft-drive tranny design originated well before WW-2 and it has not fundamentally changed in more than 80 years. It has proven to be durable, easy to repair and very reliable. In the aftermarket, there are several very good parts suppliers and while bits seem to be somewhat more costly than for the XS650, the supply is good and nobody is beefing about quality. These bikes were expensive when new and they are very durable even over incredibly long distances - so most of them seem to be in nice shape and people keep them going.

The one real problem (and it truly IS f@cking annoying) is the sidestand. Some nitwit in the German Ministry of Transport decided that all motorcycle sidestands should fold up as soon as weight is removed from the stand - so, when you get on the bike and stand it up vertical, you hear "CLANG" as the sidestand folds up. That is annoying enough - but when you look down to re-extend the stand, you cannot (and I do mean CANNOT) see any part of the stand from the riding position. As carefully designed by some twit in Bavaria, the sidestand is completely obscured under the carb and cylinder assembly and so you fish around with the your left toe trying to find the foot-tang while balancing the bike and once successful, you push it push it down, but usually, you cannot get it far enough forward and down to get the weight back on the stand before it goes "CLANG" again.

The first few times I rode her it must have taken me 4-5 minutes of faffing around with the invisible sidestand - plus no small amount of "extended vocabulary" - to get the bike securely parked. In fact, these bikes are rather famous for simply falling over without warning - particularly if the wind is blowing from the left side (think about it and you'll understand).

EDIT: Many people in the airhead community have installed an aftermarket sidestand called a "Brown Stand" which is much easier to deploy and does keep the bike secure. I have installed one and, while it looks like something you'd find on a Harley, it works and I'm keepin' it. I have also upgraded the instrument lights with LEDs and installed a headlight modulator (she came with one on the brake light) as well as a USB charger module and a handlebar bracket for my GPS etc. I will also be changing all three brake rotors and the hydraulic brake hoses and caliper pads in the spring and I have some other farkles planned as I want to do some trips after I retire in the late summer.

Other than that, Gretel is nearly perfect and every bit as pretty to me as she was in 1977. I guess an old gal as beautiful as this has a right to be a bit of hag the odd time. Don't worry fellas, I am not in any way abandoning my XS650s - but Gretel is a bike I have wanted since I was a teenager and at 62, there's no time like the present.

Anyhow, here she is....

1983_BMW-R100RS_Sept-12-2020.jpg 1983_R100RS-RH-rear_dual.jpg 1983_R100RS-instruments.jpg 1983_R100RS-LH-front_dual.jpg BMW_R100RS_Bagster-2.jpg
 
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