Now we are talking!!!

[mikesim]

I had a hunch that the Japanese would not surrender easily to the EV ballyhoo. They are much more practical and aware of the engineering realities of the ICE vs EV's. I'm glad not all the OEMs have been captivated by the woke madness.

Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, And Yamaha Join Forces On Hydrogen Bikes (rideapart.com)

Mike

 

[RedNigel]

I don't think the word 'woke" applies when talking about cars and motorcycles...It certainly has no place on this forum

 

[Camelot]

No kidding, give it a break. We all get your political leanings, the less said the better.

 

[DirtFlier]

I also read that article about the four Japanese motorcycle makers doing a co-op on a hydrogen bike but space is extremely limited on a motorcycle so how they'll do it is certainly a curiosity. Will Honda resurrect the PC800 and hide the hardware under all that plastic?

Along the same lines, I believe those four companies use the same batteries for their electric scooters so getting a recharged or new one while cruising around town is now much easier now.

 

[ARKNT]

One of the towns close to here put out some info that they were planning on installing a hydrogen electric generating plant.
I tried to see the size of it but the info was a bit conflicting. kind of interesting though.

Arknt

 

[Charlie U]

I had a hunch that the Japanese would not surrender easily to the EV ballyhoo. They are much more practical and aware of the engineering realities of the ICE vs EV's. I'm glad not all the OEMs have been captivated by the woke madness.

Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, And Yamaha Join Forces On Hydrogen Bikes (rideapart.com)

Mike

This will only divide us. Please leave politics off the forum.

 

[Mellow]

Woke is not political, it's just stupid, so I don't see a problem with this thread.

 

[GTFan]

The problem with hydrogen is the same problem with all ICE, there's a lot of mechanical complexity and wasted efficiency. Not to mention that we're never going to have a hydrogen infrastructure in this country, it's already been decided that we're going to go EV.

So it's interesting that Toyota keeps pushing this path but they've already lost the fight. Just look at China if you want to see the proof of that, they're rapidly going full EV.

 

[RedLdr1]

Hyundai has been selling the Nexo, which is a hydrogen vehicle, for a couple years. They only sell it in California due to fueling issues . Take a look at the APR and discounts if you buy one Here.

 

[mikesim]

The problem with hydrogen is the same problem with all ICE, there's a lot of mechanical complexity and wasted efficiency. Not to mention that we're never going to have a hydrogen infrastructure in this country, it's already been decided that we're going to go EV.

So it's interesting that Toyota keeps pushing this path but they've already lost the fight. Just look at China if you want to see the proof of that, they're rapidly going full EV.

I wouldn't bet the rent money that the EV future has already been decided. The politicians may have decided that but the engineers and scientists who have to make it happen are discovering that it is likely much more difficult and costly that even a politician can imagine. There is also inefficiencies in the EV that are not discussed by their proponents. A hydrogen powered ICE is just another derivation of the current technology so the mechanical complexity isn't as problematic as a new from scratch design.

Mike

 

[GTFan]

With regards to complexity I was talking about the complexity of ICE drive trains versus electric, in fact some dealers are slow rolling EV sales because they know it's going to greatly impact their service departments. Once EV manufacturing ramps up the cost of these vehicles is going to go down as well because there are far less components.

And it's not just politicians that have decided to go EV, all of the American car manufacturers are fully on board with this and that's the direction that they were taking even before the infrastructure bill. So I don't really see how hydrogen has a future here if none of our carmakers are interested in it.

I'm not against hydrogen per se, I just think it's silly to think that we're going to crank out a hydrogen infrastructure side by side with an EV infrastructure. It's just not going to happen.

This has nothing to do with whatever you want to define as 'woke' by the way, it's just reality. Again, look at China. They're leading the way and they have over a billion people. If they thought hydrogen was better than EV they would have done it.

 

[mikesim]

You misunderstood my original post. EV's in and of themselves I don't consider to be "woke". It is the notion put forth by politicians and those who consider themselves "woke" is that we can at the snap of a finger transition smoothly and economically away from ICE and adopt EV's. Your China example is a good one and fits into my position precisely. The Chinese have no fear of an abundant supply of EV's as they are building coal fired power generation stations at a rate three times greater than the rest of the world combined! This is to complement the already 1,100 coal fired plants on stream in China since 2022. The US on the other hand is mandating that all new vehicles sold after 2035 must be EV. The US has made no provision however for the generation capacity to fuel these EV's. They are relying on the utilities to provide renewable power via solar and wind turbines. In fact President Biden declared just last week that if our existing coal fired plants cannot meet designated air quality goals by 2030, they must be shut down. Solar and wind BTW are not dispatchable sources 24/7 so we are at the mercy of mother nature to provide the sun and wind to keep our EV's rolling. Additionally, we do not have the infrastructure in place for all the charging stations should they become necessary. The energy density of the lithium cells is nowhere near that of fossil fuels or hydrogen. I could go on but I think you see my concern and it doesn't have anything to do with "woke" It is engineering reality, not a politicians wishful thinking.

Mike

 

[Camelot]

In the end things will change, the old whiners will be in the dirt, hopefully with the term “woke” buried with them and the world will go on just fine without the negativity.

 

[NewTo700V]

Too much talk, not enough riding. I'd suggest anyone using the term "woke" unironically should probably reduce their intake of their MSM of choice and go outside for some fresh air. There's too many decades old Honda bikes laying around with barely any miles on them.

 

[coaster]

Woke is not political, it's just stupid, so I don't see a problem with this thread.

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "Woke" ?

 

[RedLdr1]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "Woke" ?

See Here.

 

[mikesim]

Thanks Wayne for posting that. I was at a loss to succinctly define "woke". Even the definition you posted doesn't really describe the whole "woke" universe. Some think that I used the term as a perjorative but in actuality it is a term that the "woke" have assigned to themselves. It is a group of people who feel that their knowledge/beliefs are superior to others thus they are "awake" to this knowledge or belief. Those who disagree with the "woke" accepted belief/knowledge are thus "unwoke" and are to have their different beliefs/knowledge dismissed and are not allowed to express themselves. Thus the beginning of the cancel culture phenomenon we are seeing in our universities. I hope that clarifies it without provoking anyone.

Mike

 

[Warren]

I just read that Walmart was planning on putting in charging stations at its stores. Also Costco and Walgreens. I believe you will have to pay for usage.

 

[Coyote Chris]

I just read that Walmart was planning on putting in charging stations at its stores. Also Costco and Walgreens. I believe you will have to pay for usage.

Correct, and they see it as a revenue stream rather than a loss leader.....as we say in France, C'est Avoir.

 

[Coyote Chris]

I also read that article about the four Japanese motorcycle makers doing a co-op on a hydrogen bike but space is extremely limited on a motorcycle so how they'll do it is certainly a curiosity. Will Honda resurrect the PC800 and hide the hardware under all that plastic?

Along the same lines, I believe those four companies use the same batteries for their electric scooters so getting a recharged or new one while cruising around town is now much easier now.

On the other side of the coin is that Honda is bringing back the street scrambler, a 425 lb CL500 parallel twin....While I dont like the weak display contrast, which may be changeable, I love those fork gaiters....with twin rear shocks, they could enclose the chain...
(see pm about question for you)