Trying the ABS?

[Cameron]

A couple days ago, I was commuting to work in a cold drizzle while in the right lane of three traveling in my direction. Crowning of the road wasn't noticable, but I must have hit a patch of ice while braking lightly for an upcoming light. The bike slipped to the right and my left foot instinctively went from the peg to the ground and just as quickly the bike was riding smoothly again. Don't remember any pulsing of the brake or anything so I'm not sure if the ABS actually kicked in or I was "good" at doing something, or if I was just lucky the black ice ended before I went down. Regardless, I was shocked at the quickness of the event even traveling at 10-15 mph. My butt didn't get a chance to pucker until I had completed my stop at the light.

Overnight we had a light snow but the walkway was icy when I checked this morning, so I decided to take the train today - something about the better part of valor. Can't remember the last time I didn't commute three days in a single month. Has to be at least a couple years since our record snowfall winter. I'm really looking forward to Spring!

 

[Phil Tarman]

The only time I think my ABS has kicked in was on a wet street in Marshalltown, Iowa. It had rained hard, but the rain had stopped about 30 minutes before the incident. I was following two friends through town when a woman blew through a red light. I did not squeeze the brakes. I grabbed 'em! I am pretty sure I felt about two pulses of the ABS. The bike stopped quickly and smoothly. The woman never saw me. I'm pretty sure I would have gone down without the ABS.

 

[Warren]

The only time my ABS has kicked on was on gravel at an intersection. I was turning left at a 4 way stop and the person on my left decided to go ahead of me. I was in mid turn and pulled the front brake hard. I was only going about 5mph at most but on the gravel in a turn the ABS kick in and it stopped me and I did not go down. I missed the side of the car by about a foot. Without ABS I am sure the front wheel would have locked and I would have went down or hit the car.

 

[slider]

I was going around a sharp curve a 1/2 mile from my house. There's cinders on the road in spots because my township is too cheap to use anything else. Right into the curve this lady came around the other way right in the middle of the road. I grabbed some front brake and came to almost a complete stop as she breezed by 2" away. No doubt without abs this rookie was in the woods.

 

[slider]

Thank GOD you guys were okay!!!!!!!!

I did. He says keep riding.

 

[charlie b]

I felt it for the third time when not expected the other day. Had a truck (BIG truck) pull over in front of me. I pulled on the brake fast and hard. Brakes pulsed several times on me. To tell the truth I didn't think I pulled on them that hard so was kinda surprised when I felt the pulsing. But, to me honest, the Guzzi brakes take a LOT more force to lock up so a comparison is kinda invalid.

I was just glad no one was close behind me.

I wish I could retrofit ABS to the Guzzi.

 

[karl]

I don't think I have heard or read more misinformation on any topic. The increased stopping distance is a personal favorite.

 

[Phil Tarman]

I don't think I have heard or read more misinformation on any topic.

I gues you're talking about what other people say about ABS, Karl. I hear that "increased stopping distance" remark all the time, too. That's sure not my experience, either in my Buick or on my Honda. Apparently not many people here on NT-Owners buy it either.

 

[karl]

Threshold braking is something most of us never do. You need to practice to be good at it. When was the last time you heard someone say they where a lousy driver/rider. If you think you are one of the less than 1% of the riders out there that can do better, have at it.

 

[Rich]

I had a case where the ABS in my car would not permit me to stop AT ALL on a modest downhill road on wet snowpack. I was intending to make a left turn into another downhill road, but there were some kids standing around on the corner and I didn't know what they were going to do. So I tried to stop and wave them on. The car simply would not get below a fairly low speed (like 1-2 MPH). Putting the car in neutral, touching the brake pedal lightly or standing on it made no difference. The ABS would engage and prevent the car from stopping. All I could do was gesture to the kids to hold up (to their credit, they were watching me as intently as I was them), give up trying to stop and go ahead and turn. The car was an AWD Subaru and had no trouble making the turn under power.

I had occasion to come the other way on this same route the following morning and driving up presented no difficulty. It has long been acknowledged that in very loose conditions (gravel, snow), ABS can extend stopping distances beyond what it theoretically possible. But this is the only instance I've ever run into.

 

[charlie b]

But how do you know it inceased stopping distance. Just because you could vo up the other lane is not an accurate comparison.

I do agree that at low speeds the abs can be an issue.

I have also "bypassed" tha abs on a car in extremely slick ice by pumping the brakes. The abs will let the brakes work right up to the sliding point. I stopped as others (including a polkce car ) slid into the mess. Fyi this was with a Subaru.

Anyone who says they can stop faster should have to demonstrate at a greasy intersection after a brief rain.

 

[slider]

Early ABS was terrible. New stuff is great.

 

[Warren]

I think most of what I read about taking longer to stop with ABS is on clean dry paved roads although in a recent motorcycle road test the author admitted that it took him 5 tries with the ABS turned off the beat the ABS stopping distance. When it comes to riding on slick surfaces I will take ABS anyday.

 

[Rich]

But how do you know it inceased stopping distance. Just because you could vo up the other lane is not an accurate comparison.

I do agree that at low speeds the abs can be an issue.

I have also "bypassed" tha abs on a car in extremely slick ice by pumping the brakes. The abs will let the brakes work right up to the sliding point. I stopped as others (including a polkce car ) slid into the mess. Fyi this was with a Subaru.

Anyone who says they can stop faster should have to demonstrate at a greasy intersection after a brief rain.

In this case no matter how lightly I touched or manually pumped the brakes, the ABS would kick in. This was not that old a car, either - a 98 Subaru Legacy wagon. And I had plenty of traction to initiate a 90 degree turn from the point where I could not stop without skidding. Note, again, that this is the only time I've ever experienced this situation. It's possible that with no ABS I'd have experienced the same outcome. But ABS is all about control and in most situations will do better than the driver. But let's put it this way: As far as stopping distance in this case, it wasn't any better than I might have been able to do manually.

That said, I'd rather have it than not. On a bike I can see it being a mixed blessing sometimes, though. I've found that locking up a rear wheel only isn't necessarily a big deal. I've done it (briefly) numerous times, releasing the rear brake pedal leading to perhaps a bit of tank slapping, but that's all. Unexpectedly locking up the front wheel, though, can have you beyond recovery from a crash far faster than one can react, particularly on a heavy bike. And you can not always predict how much braking action you have available. I totalled my 1st ST1300 exactly this way on a wet paved road (that I've driven thousands of times in the rain- no exaggeration) that was unpredictably more slippery than normal.

 

[Rmcapozzi]

ABS technology has significantly improved over the years since it was first made available on vehicles. Bosch now even has a version they feel is appropriate for off-road use. And not all ABS systems are the same/equal. Some are more conservative in their calculations than others, some apply theoretical wheel deceleration rates while others use skid/threshold style braking. Some pulse violently when applied (HD's Brembos) while others are silky smooth (zero pulsing) at full application (Honda's GL1800 Goldwing).

Aggressive braking in a turn with or without ABS is fraught with danger. Just remember, a wheel turning in a forward direction can still slide laterally. If that happens on a bike (like when braking heavily while leaned over in a turn), you will most likely crash. I expect eventually manufactures will develop more sophisticated stability control systems that incorporate traction control and ABS that will reduce this issue (as they have to large part on cars/trucks). I know Honda, Yamaha, Ducati and Magneti Marelli are feaverishly working on advancing traction control systems in MotoGP. Fingers crossed that technology makes its way into the production motorcycles of tomorrow.

I like what James Davis has to say about the emergency braking practice speeds. I think this is applicable regardless of if your bike has ABS or not. Everyone needs to practice good braking techniques. Quick grabbing of the brakes to immediately activate ABS is not the quickest way to slow down. ABS should be considered as an insurance policy to avoid really screwing up your braking; not as the method to stop you faster. ABS can give you confidence to push the edge of threshold braking without the fear of crashing should be a bit over eager in your application of brakes.

 

[Warren]

I am not sure any of us are engaging our ABS as a method of stopping faster. It happens in the split second that you are clamping on you brakes to avoid hitting something. In those times its a matter of instincts taking over and you either make it or you don't. Not a lot of time to think about it.

 

[RedLdr1]

I don't think I have heard or read more misinformation on any topic. The increased stopping distance is a personal favorite.

+1 :rolleyes1: A little research will debunk the ABS myths being tossed around very easily. See Here for some ABS Myths and Responses...

 

[karl]

Nice link Wayne.

 

[charlie b]

"I like ABS and I think all bikes used on the street should have it, especially for the new rider."

I know two ex-racers who insist on it on their street bikes.

 

[dnktng]

"In other words, a skilled rider on a non-ABS-equipped bike will always be safer than an unskilled rider on an ABS-equipped bike."

So for us lowly non-ABS owners, there is some hope and we need not feel inferior. My twisted interpretation of this is that if I ride with others with ABS, and we both arrive the destination safely, then I must be more skilled. Self affirmation complete.