Seems to me I read somewhere that only 20% of the HD dealer body agreed to sell the Livewire. It required a substantial investment in tools, training and infrastructure that most dealers (the smart ones) wouldn't accept.
Mike
Mike
Harley Livewire
- Thread starter Warren
- Start date
Zero was not much smarter either. I bought my from Hollywood Electrics in Hollywood, CA. The owner is a young kid that has a degree in electrical engineering. In my opinion, he's arrogant and does not know the meaning of customer service or how to run a business. The focus in his shop is to sell the units, once you bought you one, they ignore you. I had so much trouble with this shop with my long list of warranty repairs, such as no paperwork or receipts to the customer. I complained directly to Zero during my first visit there. They said that he was the best dealer in their entire worldwide network. I simply rolled my eyes when they said that.
Reniram
0
If it aint got no beautiful noisy smelly gas motor and uses oil... it aint no motorcycle...just my humble opinion... leave the stupid elec drives to the old people on bicycles!
No problem. Just take the bike to a dealer when it needs a charge. While you wait for your $30,000 toy to recharge, try not to make eye contact with the "real" bikers.
I keep creating a scene in my mind of what that's going to look like.
I keep creating a scene in my mind of what that's going to look like.
You're going to love this: After 2040 in the UK, there will be NO SALES of gasoline powered vehicle. After 2050, there will be NO gasoline powered vehicles allowed on the road. Most of Europe is on the same schedule. You and I are dinosaurs and the meteor is fast approaching.
OP
OP
Warren
2
If I am still alive in 2040 I doubt I will care
Sounds like a lot of upgrading (at least changes) to the power grid will be needed. We can't keep the power on in California now because of the scare of starting fires during those high winds.
I may not be ready for some of the changes in the coming years. I'm moving to geezerville.
Brad
I may not be ready for some of the changes in the coming years. I'm moving to geezerville.
Brad
The power was not intentionally shut off in my area. We had one between home and work on this past Friday, the Saddleridge Fire. I took the city streets to get around it. I ended up at the focal point where emergency services were staging for that neighborhood to make their stand. I got on the freeway and was riding through heavy smoke until I crested the peak into Simi Valley. I smelt like a holiday ham when I got to work. I left work at lunchtime. I had to wear a mask on the ride home. I wish I had it in the morning.
![IMG_1448[1].JPG](https://www.nt-owners.org/forums/data/attachments/5/5312-6fcacc349e9e84a149f9de5a6161d401.jpg "IMG_1448[1].JPG")
Thanks. I will have to work with the circumstances that are sent my way.
Getting back to electric motorcycles. As many have read in the previous post that I did not have a pleasurable experience owning a Zero Motorcycles SR. There were a few high points, such as me saving over $800 per year commuting on the bike. It did have exceptional acceleration. The torque curve was governed to prevent people from hurting themselves. What it was worth, I did enjoy owning an electric motorcycle for a short time. Just not Zero Motorcycles.
I was seriously let down a lot by Zero Motorcycles as a company and the terrible dealer I was forced to deal with at times. The idea behind the concept of electric motorcycles has plenty of merits, just not the one that I had. I discourage anyone looking to buy a Zero Motorcycles of any model.
I am sure that some manufacturer will get it right. My money is on the Japanese will be making the breakthrough that barrier and will make them both reliable and durable. I do not think that a range of 120-150 miles at highway speeds of 75 MPH 1-2 hour charge times using a Level 2 charger through the growing EV charger infrastructure. I do not think that is not too much to ask for.
I got the newest (now-quarterly) Cycle World magazine last night. I haven't looked at it in detail yet, but there's a long article on the Livewire that appeared to tout it as a major technical breakthrough in electric motorcycle design. Of course, that article was written well before the recall action and shutdown of production.
I read the article and it was worded in a way that illustrated the technological breakthrough for Harley, not e-bikes in general. From what I've read, the Livewire breaks no new ground EV wise. I just used the latest technology and attached an eye watering price to it.
Mike
Just saw this on MSN.com:
"Hey, remember when we learned Monday that Harley-Davidson had to stop production of its fancy new LiveWire electric motorcycle? Well, Harley-Davidson representatives confirmed to Roadshow on Friday that the production lines have started back up.
"After completing rigorous analysis this week, we have resumed LiveWire production and deliveries. Customers may continue riding their LiveWire [motorcycles] and are able to charge the motorcycle through all methods," a Harley-Davidson representative said in a statement. "Temporarily stopping LiveWire production allowed us to confirm that the nonstandard condition identified on one motorcycle was a singular occurrence. We take pride in our rigorous quality assurance measures and our drive to deliver the world's best motorcycles."
"Reuters first reported on the LiveWire production stoppage on Monday, citing a "nonstandard condition" in the electric motorcycle and a problem in final quality checks.
"A Harley-Davidson spokesperson said in a statement at the time that the problem required more testing and analysis, but the company didn't say what the "nonstandard condition" might be. The issue was serious enough to pause production and deliveries, though the company assured those who'd taken delivery of a LiveWire that the motorcycle was A-OK to ride.
"The LiveWire was meant to kick off a new chapter at Harley-Davidson, which is looking to attract a new generation of motorcycle riders as its aging buyers begin to retire from the two-wheeled life. With plenty of tech, 105 horsepower and honest good looks, the LiveWire checks a lot of boxes. In our first ride, after a long time from concept to production, Editor-in-Chief Tim Stevens found the electric Harley LiveWire was well worth the wait."
So, we shall see what we shall see.
"Hey, remember when we learned Monday that Harley-Davidson had to stop production of its fancy new LiveWire electric motorcycle? Well, Harley-Davidson representatives confirmed to Roadshow on Friday that the production lines have started back up.
"After completing rigorous analysis this week, we have resumed LiveWire production and deliveries. Customers may continue riding their LiveWire [motorcycles] and are able to charge the motorcycle through all methods," a Harley-Davidson representative said in a statement. "Temporarily stopping LiveWire production allowed us to confirm that the nonstandard condition identified on one motorcycle was a singular occurrence. We take pride in our rigorous quality assurance measures and our drive to deliver the world's best motorcycles."
"Reuters first reported on the LiveWire production stoppage on Monday, citing a "nonstandard condition" in the electric motorcycle and a problem in final quality checks.
"A Harley-Davidson spokesperson said in a statement at the time that the problem required more testing and analysis, but the company didn't say what the "nonstandard condition" might be. The issue was serious enough to pause production and deliveries, though the company assured those who'd taken delivery of a LiveWire that the motorcycle was A-OK to ride.
"The LiveWire was meant to kick off a new chapter at Harley-Davidson, which is looking to attract a new generation of motorcycle riders as its aging buyers begin to retire from the two-wheeled life. With plenty of tech, 105 horsepower and honest good looks, the LiveWire checks a lot of boxes. In our first ride, after a long time from concept to production, Editor-in-Chief Tim Stevens found the electric Harley LiveWire was well worth the wait."
So, we shall see what we shall see.
This guy gushes over this LiveWire bike. Of course he appears to be a hard core Harley guy......so no surprise.
Hmm, you wouldn't see that happen at any of the other motorcycle companies.:unsure: H-D making a play that they are really in to QA is an interesting new angle.
If the sales of the Livewire are dismal which I suspect is the case, a few days lost production didn't hurt anything. It gives the PR flacks something to crow about.
I believe that Harley is not the right company to electrify the motorcycle industry. Their core demographic is true to the old ideas of what the company has represented for over the last 100 years. These would be the last people to adopt/accept this new concept.
There have already been a handful of companies that tried to accomplish this task, many have gone away. Zero Motorcycles is only one of that handful still around. Their bikes were designed like industrial equipment, they tried to have one design to cover multiple models. If you did not mind at all having a bike that looks like two or more models. My experience was that this company is in its infancy and lacks the needs experience to bring a good and reliable product to the market that has been thoroughly tested prior to production.
I do believe that any of the four Japanese manufacturers are better positioned to accomplish this task and bring a reliable electric motorcycle to the masses. It has been proven many times over those stand-alone companies trying to produce an electric motorcycle have failed. Zero Motorcycles believes that they are at the top of the mountain and they are untouchable. The fact is that they are selling a marginal product and use the pubic as their test guinea pigs.
There have already been a handful of companies that tried to accomplish this task, many have gone away. Zero Motorcycles is only one of that handful still around. Their bikes were designed like industrial equipment, they tried to have one design to cover multiple models. If you did not mind at all having a bike that looks like two or more models. My experience was that this company is in its infancy and lacks the needs experience to bring a good and reliable product to the market that has been thoroughly tested prior to production.
I do believe that any of the four Japanese manufacturers are better positioned to accomplish this task and bring a reliable electric motorcycle to the masses. It has been proven many times over those stand-alone companies trying to produce an electric motorcycle have failed. Zero Motorcycles believes that they are at the top of the mountain and they are untouchable. The fact is that they are selling a marginal product and use the pubic as their test guinea pigs.
OP
OP
Warren
2
I agree with your thoughts. Honda and Yamaha are already well on their way with electric motorcycles and scooters. In areas where they might lack in engineering expertise they have already partnered with like minded suppliers for motors and batteries. With their Asian manufacturing footprint when they are ready to go watch out. Unlike Harley and Zero that are focused on higher end more expensive electric motorcycles Honda and Yamaha are focusing on smaller less expensive ones more for their commuting value rather than high performance. I would guess that the US market is not their primary intended target since commuting by small two wheel vehicles is not what we do much of here.
Energy storage is the main thing holding e-vehicles back. A Korean Engineer friend of mine has developed a hydrogen fuel cell bicycle with a German company. Motorcycles aren't far behind. We just need the hydrogen infrastructure.
The battery manufacturing technology is in China, S. Korea and Japan
Here is some USA tech that makes batteries charge as fast as a fillup
10 minute charge