I'm Only Looking...

[charlie b]

I am kinda surprised too. So many laughed a bit about my "20 more hp and 6 speed" comments. But, it really is true.

Honda could have the perfect sport touring bike for many if they would just pay attention. But, it is clear that they are not interested. ST and NT not in the US for several years now and no replacement in sight, not even at the motorcycle shows.

About the only bike in the weight and power class I am interested in is the Norge, and even it is a bit heavy. Why can't we have a bike that is in the neighborhood of 500lb with hard bags, decent weather protection and 90-100hp? I don't want 130hp. Insurance goes through the roof and it is more than I would use.

I'd still love to see BMW do something a bit better with the F800GT, but, until they fix the vibration problem and get the ergos a bit better it is just an old man's sport bike (or lady's bike depending on who you hear it from). What it does show is that you can have the power and touring package in a lighter bike.

One of these days I'll have to weigh mine and see what it is. I suspect I am in the 550lb range, with my 'heavy' cans and all. Stock it was only 480lb.

 

[Chucksklrst]

Chuck. Which screen did you put on the FJR?

21 inch Cee-Bailey

 

[JohnC]

Replacing the stock windshield is on the list for me also. I am looking at either Cee-Bailey or the Yamaha Touring windshield.

And revisiting earlier posts in this thread:

Well, thanks, John, but my daily average on the Epic Ride was only about 300 mi/day. The IBR guys ride 11-12,000 miles in 11 days.

300 miles per day everyday for about 2 months straight is a respectable amount of mileage. I suspect that someone in fairly good shape could gut out IBR type mileage, then stop.

On the other hand, there was John Ryan.

 

[bicyclist]

Why can't we have a bike that is in the neighborhood of 500lb with hard bags, decent weather protection and 90-100hp?

Pretty close to what I want. Plus better-than-50 mpg and non-chain drive.

 

[Chucksklrst]

Pretty close to what I want. Plus better-than-50 mpg and non-chain drive.

As I have said. Here it is.

 

[Phil Tarman]

Re: I'm Only Looking...








Originally Posted by charlie b:
"Why can't we have a bike that is in the neighborhood of 500lb with hard bags, decent weather protection and 90-100hp?"


Pretty close to what I want. Plus better-than-50 mpg and non-chain drive.

That's exactly what I want!

 

[EX Winger]

Chuck says it very well in his last post

 

[charlie b]

500lb not 600lb

 

[EX Winger]

Well I suppose we could spring for a bunch of carbon fibre parts as the super priced Ducatie has, but I don't want to guess at the cost that would make it sell for.

 

[banjoboy]

I so rarely start a new thread that I can't find/remember how to start one, but this thread is close to my issue I've looked twice at the Yamaha FJ09, a bike with 115 horsepower and a 100 pounds lighter than our NT. I've even 'joined' the FJ09.org website with questions. This is a six speed bike and some on their thread are getting in the mid 50 mpg range, close to our bikes. The big downside for me is the chain and also that it doesn't have any protection for a SAD which I've done at least five times since I've had my NT. Our 'wings' do an admirable job with the bike tips over. I think they are suggesting a 'slipper' or something like that that bolts onto the frame to protect the engine area when/if the bike is dropped. There is an option of putting 'soft' luggage on the sides so I guess the side bags wouldn't get scratched as my does. With the options I want (side bags, top tank, and some other things), the cost is close to $13,000. My NT is paid off, but I'm guessing the trade in value is about 5K. They have Rich's NT that he traded for an FJR about 3 years ago still for sale at 5,999. Rich is from Whidbey Island BTW. His bike is really pristine and mine looks fairly beat up next to his. The FJ09 has three road settings--aggressive, standard, and a 'B' setting, which reduces the power about 20%. This would be what I'd start with as I am a little afraid of a bike that's 100 pounds lighter with twice the horsepower as our NTs. I'm 68 years old and I'm waiting for Phil to stop riding before I stop riding and I wonder whether or not to keep the NT and ride it until I quit or move to the FJ09. Any thoughts? All thoughts on this are welcome.

Terry

 

[mikesim]

Some of the other bikes seem good and are worth looking at. There are three things that are a "turnoff" for me on most bikes.

• Rain and cold protection. Most bikes seem designed for California or some other drought area where they don't get rain. I'm putting on 70 miles each day commuting to Longacres and I need the protection for the lower body that most other bikes don't have. It isn't like they don't come with it from the factory and have an accessory you can buy...they don't even consider it. That's great for fair-weather riders. That doesn't fit my needs at all.
• Chain. I've heard you need to clean and lube your chain if you ride in the rain. If so, I'd be doing so each day I ride. With the NT, I just pull the bike into the garage and get my laptop bag and walk inside. Sweet.
• Power. The additional power is addictive. Reality sets in though. How fast do I want to accelerate? I can easily leave virtually anyone behind me if the light turns green. But I'm not planning on racing up to 60-70 or even 100 mph from a stop light in a 35 mph area. How much faster can I get to 35 mph with twice the horsepower? Or what will I do when I'm not the first in line? Oh...accelerate like I already do, with the traffic all around me. The same thing holds true on the freeway. I don't ride on wide open roads, but with a lot of traffic and those wonderful LEOs on the freeway. So while the additional horsepower seems nice...why? I have no real way to use it.
• The various suspension settings seem great. They remind me of the Burgman 650 with the trick eCVT and its Power, Normal and Manual modes. It's a gadget that I'd bet 95% of the owners use for the first week and then never touch again. So I can adjust the suspension on the fly...I've only adjusted my suspension twice in 19,000 miles. I doubt I'd do it more often with a button to push. I'm not a racer.
• Cost. I can pay cash for any bike on the market. But this one is paid for, and I find other bikes have nothing on it for a total package. They are better in one way or another, but not on all counts.

Chris

Yeah.... what he said!

MIke

 

[bicyclist]

I agree with Chris on all counts. In my opinion, the only advantage the FJ has is lighter weight (and maybe better handling. Can't say as I haven't ridden one.) In every other area, the NT does a good job. Especially for one living in the Northwet, the excellent fairing and shaft drive offer great benefit. If I lived there, I'd have a roof on my bike. Terry, your bike is paid for. You could buy enough gas with the difference in cost to visit all tof the states and all of the provinces and territories and pay for a motel room every night.

 

[RedLdr1]

Any thoughts? All thoughts on this are welcome.

My ? Well first I better qualify where that loose change is coming from I suppose... Now that I'm retired I'm a "recreational rider" and the issues that concern daily commuters often don't matter to me anymore. Looking at it from that mindset there are a lot of different bikes available to enjoy for their abilities, and their supposed shortcomings :rolleyes1:. For me life is to short to be "married" to any bike, or brand, so after around two years I'm ready to try something else. I just looked at a FJ-09 yesterday to be a "little brother" to my FJ1200. I liked the bike but have decided to go a different direction.

 

[EX Winger]

Chris makes some very good argumentsfor staying with the NT. Thinkngs not mentioned are Mother Hondas cheap PIA BAG latches and the inability to remove them. If you have never had power in y our past you don't miss it. The buggest thing I missed on NT was the power after 100 plus thousand moles og GL1800 Wing. this past summer I had four occasions when I started , or was in the process of passing when some smart *** would keep increasing his speed to put me in harms way. this is where power comes into play, a large displacement engine pays for itself in those occasions, be it ST13, FJR 13, etc, etc.

Also amost of the options you have to pay for to have on the NT, ST1300 etc come included on the FJR, with std 2014's with out the ES foing gor $12,000.00 they are a far better buy than the 2011 NT was at $11,199.00.Yes they still need some mods, like Heli riser system and a decent seat and a windshield change, and a top box. The stock head light is very good alone, taking the Denali D-2 system from the NT and the fjr horn is no better than the NT but the stebil horn just made the FJR better and safer. the canyon cages when added to FJR give you a place to mount highway pegs and will save all of your Tupperware from a parking lot or driveway tip over, ASK me how I know

Eldon

 

[Chucksklrst]

Everybody's reasoning and life circumstance are different, and the reason why one picks this bike over that bike are interesting but none of the reasons are wrong or incorrect. I am gong to re-post my reasoning as to why my ST and NT gave way to the FJR. Just a side note, (I got to help Guitarman add some electrical farkles on his NT, so if I get to missing the NT I just go down to his place.) I was looking for less weight from the ST1300 and more smooth power from the NT700. Plus factory cruse control.

Here is a piece that I wrote to someone who was asking about why I defected from the ST1300 and the NT700 and the pros and cons of my FJR over my ST. If my 2003 ST1300 was not 12 years old and had 130000 miles and I was a lot younger than 65 I might have keep my ST 1300 longer. But I tend to keep my main ride bikes for about 10 yeas and I wanted something to take me to my mid 70's The FJR is most likely going to be my last Sport touring bike.

............ here is something I wrote on the ST-riders Forum/list.

As much as I loved my two ST's that I have owned over the last 22 years. (92 ST1100, 03 ST1300) Honda is going to be hard pressed to get any new Sport Touring ST even close to the Generation III FJR, at a reasonable price point. As I said before The FJR does everything thing the ST does but better with the exception of three items, Stock wind shield, Tip over bars, and Fuel range. Two of which is correctable with the after market and the third is not an issue at my age. Wink After having owned my FJR for almost three months and over 2500 miles now, I wonder why I did not make the switch earlier. The bike has/does every thing that we have been asking Honda to give us in the ST. Less weight, more power, and up grades in the electronics. Obviously Yamaha has been listing to Honda ST owners. Sadly, still no sixth gear. grin I would not hold your breath too long waiting for Honda, you might just turn blue and pass out.

Shaft maint is a one time deal. Very easy on the FJR a lot more complicated on the ST1300, especially having to remove the swing arm. So I did it up front instead of later when I needed to.

I was looking for less weight, more stability, a newer up dated bike, and the red color, all with out giving up the performance of the ST. The FJR met those criteria. Major + for the FJR over the ST1300 is weight, stability, ease of maint. (although I have not done a valve check yet) and on the Gen III's the cruise control, heated grips,gear indicator, traction control. Throttle response is wonderful, no jerky on/off from the fuel injection. Nice STuff is the sport/touring mode selection. STOCK seat is better for my *** then the STOCK ST seat. Major negs for the FJR: wind shield sucks, but fixed with an after market shield. Down side on the FJR is seating position is more sport. More forward lean and pegs a bit higher. Fixed with risers and, lower pegs (farkel to come). The bike is different than the ST but not in a negative way. Service manual is laid out and written a bit different then Honda. Kind of like a Phillips X-Ray service manual vs. GE X-Ray service manual. A bit of a learning curve in all aspects but a fun curve. Don't like the OEM tires on the FJR. will replace with PR4GT when these wear out.I am being a bit conservative in the twisties until then. But then I am old anyway. Hope I answered your questions, If not let me know. Come on over some time and take a closer look at it.

Chuck H, with no more Honda's in the garage after 33 years of Honda motorcycles.

 

[banjoboy]

Well, thank you all for your input. I'm feeling a bit schizophrenic on this at the moment. Eldon wrote me a private message (thank you Eldon) that the NT may have a very low trade in value and it that were true, then that might be the deal breaker. I'll let you all know over time what I do. Again, more input is fine on this as I keep going back and forth.

Terry

 

[Chucksklrst]

Well, thank you all for your input. I'm feeling a bit schizophrenic on this at the moment. Eldon wrote me a private message (thank you Eldon) that the NT may have a very low trade in value and it that were true, then that might be the deal breaker. I'll let you all know over time what I do. Again, more input is fine on this as I keep going back and forth.

Terry

Terry, 1. Determine what YOU really want in a motorcycle. Not what you think you need or can live with, but what the heart says you really want. 2.Then determine which bikes come closest to that and put them in a priority order 3. Decide if your finances can support your #1 choice and if not move to your #2 choice, etc. 4. Go buy it and 5. Go Ride. Only worry about trade in value after you have made your choice. Once the money is spent, it will not be thought about again. You only live once. With all this said , the NT is a fine little machine, and in my later years I might have one again.

 

[Phil Tarman]

Chris and Terry, there are several new bikes on the way that look interesting. One is the Kawasaki Versys, in both 650 and 1000cc versions. The MT-09 Tracer is in England, maybe it'll come to the US. It's got some fairing and looks good in lots of ways. Soft luggage is an option.

But they've all still got a chain. They've all still got less weather protection than the NT.

I'm sticking with my NT and with the NT after this one (I think ).

 

[banjoboy]

Chris, you've raised many excellent points as I knew you would. I think this is in part a minor 'existential' dilemma and was waiting for Phil to chime in. At 68, I think I have about five to seven good years of riding well. I've talked to my wife about Phil and had said that when Phil quits, I'll have a benchmark to look at. And Yet. Here's Eldon that I think is 75 and is riding the heck out of his bikes. Many of us on this site are older and we still ride and ride. I loved watching Ewan McGregor's Long Way Down, but there is no way on earth that I would attempt that ride, but I respect him for it. My brother in law (who is rebuilding two old BMWs) sent me an article from mlsmagazine.co.uk with a very nice review of our NT, their Deauville. Their concluding line is, "Even if a Deauville isn't the motorcycle you want, it's probably the one you need...Everything a big tourer can do, slightly less fast." This is about as fair a review as I've seen of our bike. Again, any thoughts on this is welcome.

Terry

 

[seagrass]

Chris I am keeping my NT and I have no intention of leaving the forum so when you come back in six months at least two of us will be here