In the Shop...

[Phil Tarman]

I rode into Sun Honda this morning to let them have the bike for a few days (hopefully). They're going to fix the pannier latch on the right side. The rear striker plate was hitting something that wouldn't let it close so I had taken it off a month or so ago and just hadn't carried anything in the right pannier. In the last week, I've had a very slight oil drip from the left side of the motor about half-way back. I think it's coming from the filter, but I'd never seen even a little drip before. I doubt if it's amounted to two teaspoons in a week, but I don't want oil leaking at all. I'm figuring that both of these repairs will be warranty issues.

While they've got it and since I trust the mechanic who has always been straight with me, I'm also having them diagnose the issue with my Denalis. The left one mainly doesn't work at all (although ever now and then it'll be on and the right one will be off), and the right one has been way dimmer than normal. Kevin (I think) at Twisted Throttle told me it was probably the Y-connector in the harness needing some corrosion cleaned.

It's something I could have done, but Nic will do it quicker and I've got a lot going on for the next 3 months and 3 weeks.

Both the service manager and the service writer said, "You want a new front tire?" But I'm going to wait a tad longer on that. I've got a new pair of PR3s waiting to be mounted. I'm at a bit over 16,000 miles on the front and there's still tread. I'll probably change it in a month or two before I go to Fort Worth to do my niece's wedding, and then get the rear one put on in late June before Rick and I head north.

Anybody else had any oil leaks? What were they?

 

[Phil Tarman]

Sun got right on my bike and just called to let me know what they'd found.

The oil leak was a water pump. Warranty item.

Good ol' Nic found a cracked muffler. Warranty item.

Left fork seal. They're going to try to push them through under warranty and replace them both. I'm a bit surprised at that since the forks have had the NOJ boots on them since right after the first fork seal failed due to dried bug shells at about 20,000 miles.

As far as the Denalis, that was a bad relay. Not a warranty item.

If the fork seals aren't covered under warranty, they'll cost about $400.

 

[slider]

Good for you but seems like a good amount of stuff to fix on a Honda. No? Of course dropping it a few times probably didn't help. When you put these NOJ's on are you supposed to put it over plastic and all or wedge it inside the plastic?

 

[DirtFlier]

The water pump fits into the crankcase very low so the drive end is partially immersed in engine oil all the time. If you put it on the sidestand, it's completed immersed. The water pump is driven by the oil pump which is on the opposite side of the crankcase.
There is a water pump seal (for the shaft) but if that fails, you'd have oil in the coolant. The most common failure is the O-ring that seals the drive of the water pump into the case. I've changed those two times on different PC800s but at much higher mileage so am surprised at your leak. Oh well...it was covered by warranty!

 

[Phil Tarman]

Sam, Sun's estimates seem like they're always worst case scenarios. The final bill has never been as high as they tell me to expect. Nic the mechanic has done well by me and I'm guessing that I won't get charged inordinately for these seals. I don't really have a more convenient shop available and for the next three months and three weeks I sure don't have any time to do any work myself, even if I had some accomplished mechanic holding my hand. In the "good ol' days," the shop manager and service writer were good friends and went out of their way to treat me better than right. I had bought my first Concours from the service writer when he was a salesman 14 years ago. The new manager and writer don't know me, but the dealership sure has a better attitude than they did 14 years ago. At that time, after the 600-mile service on my Connie, I had problems that I hadn't had when I took the bike in for that check. Including the fact that when I picked the bike up, it only had 20psi in the tires and the service manager blamed it all on the salesman.

11 years after that, when I bought the NT, the salesman who sold me the Connie was a service writer and he promised me that the service department had changed. As far as I can tell, they have. I'll make a final judgment after I see the bill for replacing fork seals.

About the installation of the NOJ fork boots: I zip-tied them over the fork protectors at the bottom; the velcro holds them fine once they're clear of the stock protectors.

 

[bicyclist]

My guess is that there's a tiny ding in the surface of the fork tube from before the fork boots were installed and that's why the second seal failed. It's also possible that something got under the neoprene and worked on the tube. Phil, you should ask them to carefully inspect the fork tube when they do the work. Remind them that this is the second failure.

I'm also shocked at the estimate. On Ron Ayers site, the fork seal/dust seal set for one leg is about $12. If the wear parts inside the fork are replaced (probably not a bad idea at that mileage) they total about another $12. So, maybe $50 in parts plus some for fork oil.

With respect to the water pump, as Dirt Flier says, the pump body is sealed into the case with an o-ring. The pump shaft has two seals on it separated by an air space. The one on the inside is an oil seal and the one on the outside is a coolant seal. The air space is connected to a weep hole in the pump body and serves to prevent either fluid from contaminating the other if one of the seals fails. If a shaft seal fails, it requires replacing the pump. If the o-ring fails, you simply pull the pump and replace the o-ring.

 

[slider]

I hope I can learn a quarter of what some of you know about bikes in the next couple years. I also hope I don't need much of it.

 

[Coyote Chris]

I asked my Kawasaki dealer what he would charge to rebuild the forks on my Connie if I removed them and brought them in. He said $135 apiece.
I took them off, flushed the heck out of them, replaced the fluid and used SealMates on them to clean the seals...one weeps a tad....I can live with that.
I dont think Phil is getting a bad deal, considering all those miles...looks like that extended warrenty is working out for him!

 

[Bear]

I am glad I got the extended warranty because Merlot is going in the shop in March to fix a leaking drive train. Looks like an O ring or oil seal are the culprit.

 

[Phil Tarman]

I had really figured I'd have another 50,000+ on the bike before I used that warranty. It's a good thing to have when we put bunches of miles on.

 

[slider]

So should I buy an extended warranty or not? I never buy them but my bike did sit around for a year. I have a couple months before the original runs out and the ABS light has already stayed on a few times...

 

[Phil Tarman]

Slider, I bought the extended warranty which added four years to the original for $???. Can't remember how much, but the dealer also gave me the first two services and LoJack, so I figured the warranty cost me less than $200. The water pump replacement is going to make it worth while.

I'm at nearly 53,000 miles in two years and ten months. By the time Rick and I do our 25-26,000 mile ride I'll be at 85,000 miles in 3 1/2 years. So before that warranty runs out, I'll likely have 120,000+. I figure the warranty coverage is gonna' be well worth it for me.

 

[Warren]

I think Phil nailed it. If you are into high annual mileage its probably worth it. The NT is pretty reliable so if you ride 5K annually its probably not worth getting. It might also depend on how good a mechanic you are and how much extra money you have to pay for repairs. As with most things the answer depends on your situation. I usually never get extended warranties. I bought a Fit and the NT in the same month. Got the extended warranty on the bike but not the car.

 

[slider]

OK. I'll probably do 12k a year. I see prices all over the place for warranties. Dealers even have them on eBay. I guess I'll see what the dealer offers and go from there. Probably not a big difference in warranty/repair cost but if I can get some cool deal like Phil I'll jump on it.

 

[tawilke46]

I have found when buying cars or motorcycles, you get a much better deal on an extended warranty if you start by saying you don't want or need it, or you can get a better deal at your credit union. Guarantee they will come down on the cost.
Use the extended warranty one time and it usually pays for itself.

 

[Phil Tarman]

Just got a call from Sun Honda. Honda did OK warranty coverage of the fork seals. That's the good news.

The bad news is that they had to special order some of the fork parts (???) and say that it'll take 7-10 days from last Friday to get the bike back on the road.

Rick, if we have a situation like that while we're on the road, I hope we're in a good cheap place to hang around for a while. Or, that we can get cheap airfare home and back.

 

[Chucksklrst]

Just got a call from Sun Honda. Honda did OK warranty coverage of the fork seals. That's the good news.

The bad news is that they had to special order some of the fork parts (???) and say that it'll take 7-10 days from last Friday to get the bike back on the road.

Rick, if we have a situation like that while we're on the road, I hope we're in a good cheap place to hang around for a while. Or, that we can get cheap airfare home and back.

Most likely the seals and dust covers. Are they replacing the bushings also. If so, those need to also be ordered. Parts can be ordered over night but it gets expensive. I did that once with a water pump gasket for my ST. The shipping cost more than the part. Are you guys going to camp on your epic ride?

 

[EX Winger]

Sounds like they had to get parts from accross a pond, But that is better than some horror stories reguarding final drive parts for some other kind of bike.

But Phil, if you were on the road and had a similar problem you could probably ride yourselfe out of it to a better locationand confirm that they have the parts on hand before teardown, etc.

eldon

 

[Phil Tarman]

They called back a bit ago and said it was the bushings that were back ordered. They asked if I wanted them to get it put back together and then bring it back in when the bushings arrived so they could do the forks. That was a better deal for me than waiting for an unknown amount of time for bushings to come.

Yes, Chuck, Rick and I are camping on the Ride, probably 2-3 nights out of every 3-4. We'll check into a motel ever so often to hose off and wash underwear and socks.

Eldon, after reading the adventures of Cack on ADVriders, I'm confident of being able to ride for a long time after anything happens. If you guys haven't read that story, it's about a guy and his PC800. No instrument panel, no oil in the forks, painted a glorious mixture of a bright orange fading to yellow, a stick to hold the trunk open. He and his son ride it to the west coast. Later he and his daughter ride it to Alaska. Then some guy he's never met rides it back to the lower 48. Good writing and great pictures in all three ride reports. Cack gives me confidence to ride a less than mechanically perfect bike relatively long distances.

 

[Warren]

Before spending a lot of money fixing a leaky seal you guys might want to look at adding a "sealmate" to your tool box.

http://sealmate.net/