Questions about the final drive

[Macclan5]

Would welcomed any insight on the final drive...specifically the symptoms that indicate it is failing. Long story short..went to change my rear tire (first time since owning the bike) and with the wheel off discovered one of the o-rings had failed. Below is what the final drive on the rear wheel flange set looked like. To this point never noticed anything out of the ordinary. Cleaned up the gears with rubbing alcohol...wiped it down well...coated it well with Honda moly and did a 2k ride in northern WI/MN/MI without incident. Lately when riding, it feels like something is binding up when travelling at 40 mph or higher. Motor makes no different sounds, but since I'm so worried that this is going to turn into a catastrophic failure...I'm convinced it doesn't feel right and just today for the first time, I hear a "clunk" as once in first gear and just starting to move. So...all that...any insight or words of wisdom appreciated. Bike only has about 26k and i ride it 9 months out the year. Truly enjoy it and have just the right amount of farkles. thank you. Jay

 

[Phil Tarman]

I have no idea what you're hearing or feeling, but I can guarantee that your splines look about 120% better than mine did either time I had to have my final drive rebuilt. Sorry I don't have pictures.

 

[Macclan5]

Thanks Phil...very encouraging. I have no idea on what the symptoms would be if the drive was failing as having only owned Honda motorcycles, I've never had one fail. So far my search on the web hasn't come up with much info about NT700v final drive failures.

 

[Chucksklrst]

Make sure you clean and lube those splines with at least 60% molly lube. Honda Molly 60 is what I use. Hard to find now days but any brand of 60% molly will do. Can't tell very good by the picture but it looks as if there is some wear on the splines.

 

[Brillot2000]

I personally would be looking at the universal join Item 1 in the image shown based on the “Clunk” sound you described.

Pull the rubber boot back to see if you there’s anything out of the ordinary.

 

[seagrass]

The splines on that final drive are very servicable and will give you many miles of trouble free riding in the future if they are kept properly lubricated at each tyre change.

Seagrass

 

[rc_heli_nut]

There is a flat washer between the left side wheel hub and the driven flange, if it's left out the o-rings will not work properly to seal the splines from water. Check to make sure it's there upon reassembly. At this point you may want to buy the 3 o-rings and flat washer, those splines shown in the picture are still serviceable if cleaned and lubed properly.

Honda's 60% moly has been superceded by Honda M-77 assembly paste, also available from parts houses.

The NT final drive can get clunky if the u-joint splines are dry, I've greased this area with Lucas extra heavy duty grease during a couple tire changes, it does make a difference.

Brad

 

[DirtFlier]

What is your indication "that something is binding at 40 mph"? Is the bike losing speed and if so, is your throttle hand steady?

Except for wear on the driven (wheelside) splines if not greased properly, the final drive on Honda motorcycles is pretty bulletproof. And I can't recall anyone on this website having to change a U-joint on an NT but it's not impossible.

I do vaguely recall Phil had some trouble with the bearings in the final drive?

 

[Macka]

Make sure the thrust washer is fitted correctly, the splines are cleaned/lubed correctly, the O rings are good and the damper rubbers in the rear hub are good and tight. I turned the drive pins 180 degrees on mine at 90,oookm as they were showing slight signs of wear which caused some loosness.
The Uni joint and driveshaft splines are normally good for the life of the bike but if you are worried, have a look at them too.
If the thrust washer is left out it will allow the drive "spider" to float on the splines and may clunk when it hits end to end.
The 700 always has a lot of backlash in the drive-line. It is normal.
Macka

 

[Chucksklrst]

While you have the wheel off also check your rubbers. The rubber pucks and aluminum drive inserts for wear. Here are a view pictures. These pictures are of my old NT with 32k miles on it. just before I sold it. If the aluminum is worn as in the pictures, you can turn them around and reinstall in the rubber pucks. Make sure you lube the spider fingers with silicon before you reinstall it.

 

[rc_heli_nut]

If you've removed the final drive from the swingarm, it's important to torque the rear axle first, with the nuts attaching the final drive to the swingarm left loose, in other words the final drive must be allowed to twist on the swingarm. This allows the axle to "center" the final drive and all the spacers, a bind can occur if this is not done, perhaps this is the binding you're referring to. Verify the wheel spins without binding, then finish by tightening the 4 nuts on the swingarm in a crisscross pattern to spec, I usually do this in 2-3 steps up to final torque. Then on the right side, tighten the brake stopper bolt and the pinch bolt for the RH spacer.

Brad

 

[ARKNT]

Since you are thinking there may be a problem I would pull the wheel and re-inspect it now that you have some miles on it.
Use the guidance given above to give it a good look over and look for worn rubber dampers, etc.
It will give you the peace of mind you are looking for.

Brad

 

[Phil Tarman]

During the 2nd repair of my final drive, the Honda dealer in Ft Collins left out a spacer and installed the thrust washer wrong. The first time it was rebuilt, all the cush rubbers and inserts were replaced. They were still good the 2nd time the whole drive was rebuilt.

 

[Macclan5]

Thank you everyone for all the insight. Very, very helpful. Gave me much to investigate. Currently planning over Thanksgiving to replace the rear brake pads and think that would be a good time to pull off the rear wheel and re-examine the splines and check some of the other items (thrust washers/u-joint/moly). My sense is that I'm over thinking it a bit and best to remember the reliability that is inherent with this cycle. More to follow.

 

[Macclan5]

FYI...interesting discussion on the ST-Owners site about using M-77 as a replacement for Honda moly 60.

 

[Phil Tarman]

FYI...interesting discussion on the ST-Owners site about using M-77 as a replacement for Honda moly 60.

Is there a consensus of opinion on ST-Owners about M-77? What is it?

 

[Russ Foster]

I would be very interested in typical cost of rubber pads and Al insert.

 

[Phil Tarman]

From Revzilla.com, the rubber pads (Damper set, wheel) are $43.25 and the aluminum inserts (Piece, Damper Wheel) are $14.95. [Gotta' love the part names!]

I'm not sure what the difference is in the two "Damper Set, Wheels" listed. I'm sure Revzilla could explain that.

Honda Motorcycle 2010 OEM Parts Diagram for REAR WHEEL | Partzilla.com

Buy OEM Parts for Honda Motorcycle 2010 REAR WHEEL Diagram

www.partzilla.com

 

[Chucksklrst]

Also look at Partszilla.com I have bought stuff from them and the service for me was good. (YMMV).

 

[Phil Tarman]

I typed Revzilla and just now noticed that the link I posted was to Partzilla. I had good luck with both of them back in the days before I shattered my left hand and could still manipulate tools and fasteners.